Student Who Called Hospital Worker a “Welsh C***” is Convicted of Racism
A Cardiff student has been fined for racially aggravated harassment after calling a hospital worker a “Welsh c***” during a row over her sister’s treatment. The Mailhas the story.
Layla Ahmed unleashed the verbal attack when staff at the University Hospital of Wales in Cardiff were unable to help her sister who was having a seizure on the floor.
The psychology student, 20, from Cardiff, told a guard, “You f***ing Welsh c***,” to which he responded by asking her to refrain from using racist language.
“How is that racist? You’re white. You’re Welsh,” Ahmed replied.
Ahmed then became aggressive and was asked by a security guard to leave the hospital. …
Sentencing, District Judge Rhys Williams said: “You were frustrated by the situation. You were asked to leave by the security guard and you used abusive language towards him.
“That language included a racial element and it was directed at a security guard who was only doing his job in that situation.”
He handed her a £120 fine, £50 compensation to the victim, £85 in prosecution costs and a £48 victim services surcharge, ordering Ahmed to pay at least £20 per month towards these costs.
This was certainly rude and aggressive but understandable if someone she cared for ddi not seem to be getting the treatment needed. It should not be a criminal matter.
What particularly offended the complainant? Was it the individual, someone nearby or the hospital that complained.
Was the target of the abuse offended because he was not, in fact, Welsh or because of one of the swear words which have become routine in today’s siciety. Travel on TfL or walk around any city and you are likely to hear those words. It seems some people have a very limited vocabulary and cannot express their frustration any other way.
I amn not defending the person who swore except to say the criminal law should not have been involved. I would have hoiped the judge would throw it out with a warning to all concerned to behave better and not waste court time.
However… put the shoes on the other feet: If whitey had called her a “Paki bitch” or something similar, the racism card would have been presented front and centre. Her assertion that it wasn’t racist as the person was (I assume) Welsh and “white” would not have flown an inch the other way round. Can white people not be the victims of racism?
It has to work both ways or it doesn’t work at all.
I don’t care which way round it is. Words spoken in the heat of the moment should not be a matter of criminal law. It seems chanting in aprepared way in company with others and with an intention to upset others is allowed routinely on our streets (“River to the sea” for example) but a spontaneous outburst goes to court.
It is absolutely outrageous that hurty words puts somebody in court, what did Kneel say about free speech in this country? However, if this was a sun-tanned muzzie the poor defendant would be facing a prison sentence.
I’ve never understood why “paki” is an issue and, e.g. “Aussie” isn’t. It’s an abbreviation…
But yes, of course being white/Welsh doesn’t mean that it’s impossible to experience racism. White people are now routinely racially discriminated against (by the BBC, the RAF, the intelligence services, you name it) although I don’t regard “English bastard” “Welsh cnt” ” ‘paki’ bitch” etc. as being racist; it’s just added/accurate description and so what… people need to grow up and be less bothered about words.
All that aside, the law should not have been involved in this matter. The state has no business to be policing manners, insulting language etc.
I agree – in Australia “paki” is an accepted abbreviation. When I was backpacking there 25+ years ago the headline on the sports page of one of their mainstream papers was “pakis blood three” and referred to the Pakistan cricket team giving three players their first cap and not as I assumed riots in Bradford.
It’s been an observation of mine, on those occasions when I encounter those “we don’t tolerate abuse of our staff” notices, whether those who put them up have the slightest inkling as to what, in their own behaviour, might lead to people often scared, helpless and in pain to react badly to the situation they find themselves in when faced with ‘officialdom’?
I don’t actually see that the “Welsh” component makes abusive language any more heinous than leaving it out. Would I want to see someone before the courts simply for swearing at me when I was a medical worker? I think I would store it up as one example of human failure, and maybe make a note to myself to see if such behaviour was replicated by others from her particular background.
Agree with Epping blogger that rudeness is not a criminal matter.
Reminds me of this. How the f*** can you enforce a swear ban?? And you get fined 100 quid *but only if you upset someone* with your effing and Jeffing; ”A council has been warned it will waste huge sums of taxpayers’ money if it fights a legal challenge to its controversial “swearing ban”. Toby Young, the founder and director of the Free Speech Union, arrived in Margate today to set out why the organisation is challenging Thanet District Council’s new Public Space Protection Order (PSPO). Councillors previously insisted that the rules would not prohibit casual swearing – and people would only be at risk of fines when foul language causes harassment, alarm or distress. But speaking on the beach this morning, Lord Young of Acton said: “The problem with Thanet’s swearing ban is that it bans foul or abusive language – those are very vague, capacious terms. “They have no formal meaning in law. We’re concerned that that will just be arbitrarily interpreted by the enforcement officers, and interpreted in a way which is likely to be biased. “I can understand why Thanet District Council wants to do something about antisocial behaviour in places like Margate, Ramsgate and Broadstairs but they’re… Read more »
Just one more thing that’s full-on ‘1984 thought police’. Anyone would think all actual crime had ceased to exist in England. How dare they claim they’ve no resources to investigate burglaries and chase shoplifters. Check out the video. Do officers seriously join the force to do this? Do they go home at the end of their shift thinking:”Today’s been a productive day. I’ve had a 5 hour skive escorting and minding Lefty protesters, arrested someone in their home for posting an anti-immigration comment online, moved along a Christian preacher because he was causing offense to the local Muslims ( Mashallah! ) then I cuffed a young white lad who shouted ”nice arse!” at a woman jogging. He did look like he might go on to become a right-wing extremist, to be fair.”?? “These behaviours may not be criminal offences in themselves, but they need to be addressed,” says a Surrey Police spokesperson. He’s talking about an operation where female officers are sent jogging, with a squad car ready to pull over anyone who cat-calls, wolf-whistles or beeps. Apparently, these acts might “lead on to other behaviours”. The police should stop hunting “pre-crimes” through bizarre social-psychology experiments, and focus on enforcing… Read more »
So the police are now putting a hedge around the law to make sure the actual law is never transgressed. Should they not be rebranded as “Surrey Pharisees”?
Not necessarily – social censure of foul language is rather different from criminalising it. There’s a real place for the former in challenging a society that’s become incapable of speaking a sentence without either a pejorative, a blasphemy, or an obscenity.
She isn’t ugly at all, and I think men that seem very comfortable always making nasty remarks about a woman’s appearance say a great deal about themselves as people.
I think I was the only poster the other day that didn’t slag off how that woketard American academic looked. I don’t think I saw a single post relating to the substance of the article. The entire comments section taken up with derogatory comments about how fat she was.
But that’s the DS Boys Club for you.🤷♀️
Oh God, she was a slug though. Also, your horse is too high, because I am fairly sure I also described Kier Stalin as “looking like a melted candle with down syndrome”.
“Also, your horse is too high…” Erm, no. I just don’t like disrespectful people and very much adhere to the idiom:”Play the ball, not the man.” I know, I know…An exceedingly abnormal character flaw of mine. Especially around here. Must get that looked at..🙄
Well. I suspect that since she doesn’t think that anti-whitism is racist and I suspect she’s anti-British with her Welsh slur. So that leads me to believe she’s at least of the enemy class, an enemy class in my mind that is destroying the very fabric of Western civilization. Correct or not, given my suspicions, I bet you she’s a Glasto Activist type. Now. Given all that. I think that one of the few things I can do IS to attack the man (or woman) in this case. When I attack Kier Starmers disgusting appearance, it’s with the hope that he somehow gets a mental hangup and feels bad about his stupid face, because he is a disgusting human who deserves it. When I attacked Jabba the Hut in the last article you referenced, I hope she feels insecure and ugly, because her heart is hateful and ugly and she is actively destroying truth. That is the very minimum I can do in return for their hateful, disgusting behaviour, is hopefully hit back at them in the psyche. Somewhat short of violence, I think it’s something we should all do; call them out for the ugly humans they are, inside… Read more »
If an abuser called someone a ‘Welsh Vulva’ would that be a racist criminal offence, if so how about a Welsh Nostril, is that criminal? I am rather flattered if, on the absolutely rare occasion, I am calked a C-vulva since that is the place from which all of humanity is conceived and born. Far from an insult it is a wonderful thing to the right minded, fully grounded. And being called an English C-vulva I would bristle with pride. Become quite flaccid indeed.
Alan M
8 months ago
As per the old Anton Ferdinand case, the noun doesn’t seem to be the problem, it’s the adjective that causes the complaint. To me “Welsh” is a nationality, not a race
£50 compensation to the victim? Surely the victim here was the poor sister who was convulsing on the floor and receiving no medical assistance from the wonderful NHS?
Would it still have been racist if the accused had uttered the words welsh duck or welsh thingamabob? Would that have offended the security guard?
Prickly Thistle
8 months ago
What happened to giving as good as you get?
Westfieldmike
8 months ago
And yet in Scotland, you know who read out a list of top jobs that were all white people. The tone of the ‘reading’ was distinctly a complaint about white people having jobs. That was racist.
Speaking of people who’ve earned more than their fair share of abuse, I hear that Nicola Sturgeon’s new biography has already been renamed ‘Mein Kampfervan’…
Wroxetan
8 months ago
so calling someone Welsh is a term of abuse .Is the correct term now a person of Wales ?
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This was certainly rude and aggressive but understandable if someone she cared for ddi not seem to be getting the treatment needed. It should not be a criminal matter.
What particularly offended the complainant? Was it the individual, someone nearby or the hospital that complained.
Was the target of the abuse offended because he was not, in fact, Welsh or because of one of the swear words which have become routine in today’s siciety. Travel on TfL or walk around any city and you are likely to hear those words. It seems some people have a very limited vocabulary and cannot express their frustration any other way.
I amn not defending the person who swore except to say the criminal law should not have been involved. I would have hoiped the judge would throw it out with a warning to all concerned to behave better and not waste court time.
However… put the shoes on the other feet: If whitey had called her a “Paki bitch” or something similar, the racism card would have been presented front and centre. Her assertion that it wasn’t racist as the person was (I assume) Welsh and “white” would not have flown an inch the other way round. Can white people not be the victims of racism?
It has to work both ways or it doesn’t work at all.
I don’t care which way round it is. Words spoken in the heat of the moment should not be a matter of criminal law. It seems chanting in aprepared way in company with others and with an intention to upset others is allowed routinely on our streets (“River to the sea” for example) but a spontaneous outburst goes to court.
Truly two tier justice IMHO.
It is absolutely outrageous that hurty words puts somebody in court, what did Kneel say about free speech in this country? However, if this was a sun-tanned muzzie the poor defendant would be facing a prison sentence.
Utterly appalling – tough.
I’ve never understood why “paki” is an issue and, e.g. “Aussie” isn’t. It’s an abbreviation…
But yes, of course being white/Welsh doesn’t mean that it’s impossible to experience racism. White people are now routinely racially discriminated against (by the BBC, the RAF, the intelligence services, you name it) although I don’t regard “English bastard” “Welsh cnt” ” ‘paki’ bitch” etc. as being racist; it’s just added/accurate description and so what… people need to grow up and be less bothered about words.
All that aside, the law should not have been involved in this matter. The state has no business to be policing manners, insulting language etc.
I agree – in Australia “paki” is an accepted abbreviation. When I was backpacking there 25+ years ago the headline on the sports page of one of their mainstream papers was “pakis blood three” and referred to the Pakistan cricket team giving three players their first cap and not as I assumed riots in Bradford.
It’s been an observation of mine, on those occasions when I encounter those “we don’t tolerate abuse of our staff” notices, whether those who put them up have the slightest inkling as to what, in their own behaviour, might lead to people often scared, helpless and in pain to react badly to the situation they find themselves in when faced with ‘officialdom’?
I don’t actually see that the “Welsh” component makes abusive language any more heinous than leaving it out. Would I want to see someone before the courts simply for swearing at me when I was a medical worker? I think I would store it up as one example of human failure, and maybe make a note to myself to see if such behaviour was replicated by others from her particular background.
Agree with Epping blogger that rudeness is not a criminal matter.
Reminds me of this. How the f*** can you enforce a swear ban?? And you get fined 100 quid *but only if you upset someone* with your effing and Jeffing; ”A council has been warned it will waste huge sums of taxpayers’ money if it fights a legal challenge to its controversial “swearing ban”. Toby Young, the founder and director of the Free Speech Union, arrived in Margate today to set out why the organisation is challenging Thanet District Council’s new Public Space Protection Order (PSPO). Councillors previously insisted that the rules would not prohibit casual swearing – and people would only be at risk of fines when foul language causes harassment, alarm or distress. But speaking on the beach this morning, Lord Young of Acton said: “The problem with Thanet’s swearing ban is that it bans foul or abusive language – those are very vague, capacious terms. “They have no formal meaning in law. We’re concerned that that will just be arbitrarily interpreted by the enforcement officers, and interpreted in a way which is likely to be biased. “I can understand why Thanet District Council wants to do something about antisocial behaviour in places like Margate, Ramsgate and Broadstairs but they’re… Read more »
Just one more thing that’s full-on ‘1984 thought police’. Anyone would think all actual crime had ceased to exist in England. How dare they claim they’ve no resources to investigate burglaries and chase shoplifters. Check out the video. Do officers seriously join the force to do this? Do they go home at the end of their shift thinking:”Today’s been a productive day. I’ve had a 5 hour skive escorting and minding Lefty protesters, arrested someone in their home for posting an anti-immigration comment online, moved along a Christian preacher because he was causing offense to the local Muslims ( Mashallah! ) then I cuffed a young white lad who shouted ”nice arse!” at a woman jogging. He did look like he might go on to become a right-wing extremist, to be fair.”?? “These behaviours may not be criminal offences in themselves, but they need to be addressed,” says a Surrey Police spokesperson. He’s talking about an operation where female officers are sent jogging, with a squad car ready to pull over anyone who cat-calls, wolf-whistles or beeps. Apparently, these acts might “lead on to other behaviours”. The police should stop hunting “pre-crimes” through bizarre social-psychology experiments, and focus on enforcing… Read more »
Minority Report meets with Nineteen Eighty-Four. Pre-crime meets Thought Crime.
All we need now is a new crackdown on Non-crime Hate Incidents In the Future.
So the police are now putting a hedge around the law to make sure the actual law is never transgressed. Should they not be rebranded as “Surrey Pharisees”?
And in the case of the joggers female plods get to do their fitness routines in works time and on taxpayers money.
Lurvley.
The truth hurts.
She’s just a horrible English c**t. And since we’re picking on things out of our control, she’s also ugly as hell.
Downvoters obviously see the offence that the man in question took when he reported this!
Not necessarily – social censure of foul language is rather different from criminalising it. There’s a real place for the former in challenging a society that’s become incapable of speaking a sentence without either a pejorative, a blasphemy, or an obscenity.
There was once a virtue called “courtesy.”
Foul language is one thing, but it’s the “you’re white, ergo I cannot be racist towards you”.
She isn’t ugly at all, and I think men that seem very comfortable always making nasty remarks about a woman’s appearance say a great deal about themselves as people.
I think I was the only poster the other day that didn’t slag off how that woketard American academic looked. I don’t think I saw a single post relating to the substance of the article. The entire comments section taken up with derogatory comments about how fat she was.
But that’s the DS Boys Club for you.🤷♀️
Oh God, she was a slug though. Also, your horse is too high, because I am fairly sure I also described Kier Stalin as “looking like a melted candle with down syndrome”.
It’s not women I’ll insult, it’s anyone.
“looking like a melted candle with down syndrome”.
I missed that. Bloody class. 👍👍👍
“Also, your horse is too high…” Erm, no. I just don’t like disrespectful people and very much adhere to the idiom:”Play the ball, not the man.”
I know, I know…An exceedingly abnormal character flaw of mine. Especially around here. Must get that looked at..🙄
Well. I suspect that since she doesn’t think that anti-whitism is racist and I suspect she’s anti-British with her Welsh slur. So that leads me to believe she’s at least of the enemy class, an enemy class in my mind that is destroying the very fabric of Western civilization. Correct or not, given my suspicions, I bet you she’s a Glasto Activist type. Now. Given all that. I think that one of the few things I can do IS to attack the man (or woman) in this case. When I attack Kier Starmers disgusting appearance, it’s with the hope that he somehow gets a mental hangup and feels bad about his stupid face, because he is a disgusting human who deserves it. When I attacked Jabba the Hut in the last article you referenced, I hope she feels insecure and ugly, because her heart is hateful and ugly and she is actively destroying truth. That is the very minimum I can do in return for their hateful, disgusting behaviour, is hopefully hit back at them in the psyche. Somewhat short of violence, I think it’s something we should all do; call them out for the ugly humans they are, inside… Read more »
Is she English though? I very much doubt it.
Doubtful yeah.
Of the Berkshire Ahmeds, perhaps?
If an abuser called someone a ‘Welsh Vulva’ would that be a racist criminal offence, if so how about a Welsh Nostril, is that criminal? I am rather flattered if, on the absolutely rare occasion, I am calked a C-vulva since that is the place from which all of humanity is conceived and born. Far from an insult it is a wonderful thing to the right minded, fully grounded. And being called an English C-vulva I would bristle with pride. Become quite flaccid indeed.
As per the old Anton Ferdinand case, the noun doesn’t seem to be the problem, it’s the adjective that causes the complaint. To me “Welsh” is a nationality, not a race
£50 compensation to the victim? Surely the victim here was the poor sister who was convulsing on the floor and receiving no medical assistance from the wonderful NHS?
Would it still have been racist if the accused had uttered the words welsh duck or welsh thingamabob? Would that have offended the security guard?
What happened to giving as good as you get?
And yet in Scotland, you know who read out a list of top jobs that were all white people. The tone of the ‘reading’ was distinctly a complaint about white people having jobs. That was racist.
Indeed but that Turd Worlder didn’t qualify for prison time did he? Firkin Next Tuesday.
😀
Of course, this is not a criminal matter.
That’s an appalling word and I know people will accuse me of sexism but it’s infinitely worse when a woman uses it.
Speaking of people who’ve earned more than their fair share of abuse, I hear that Nicola Sturgeon’s new biography has already been renamed ‘Mein Kampfervan’…
so calling someone Welsh is a term of abuse .Is the correct term now a person of Wales ?