The Conservative Party Shouldn’t be Reform-Lite. It Should be Reform-Xtra-Strong
A few of our political images are temporal. The one I particularly dislike, ‘delivery’, is temporal. Delivery means, if I do a Thucydidean analysis of it, “A politician talks rubbish today, and does not collect the rubbish tomorrow.”
But more of our political images are spatial. Let’s consider a few.
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The Tories are just awful, full stop. Their bases have been loaded by the WEF so no chance they’d have the sack to tackle climate bs or the lawlessness at our borders.
Writing that may be cathartic but being specific about why is informative albeit might take a long time to list everything.
I struggle to see how a Conservative official opposition will be credible challenging Keir Starmführer.
Everything they should challenge can be met with the riposte about what they did over 14 years in government.
I still want to know what the Tories spent the average annual borrowing of £128 billion on.
I never heard Labour challenge it but if wrong please do let me know.
That kind of money every year over 14 years could have worked miracles in the UK but instead has created a festering damaged country with so many problems.
When the Tory leadership was busy destroying our economy with ridiculous austerity and borrowing extortionately, how come none of the Tory backbench MPs called them out?
Are they all too thick to know better? That surely cannot be the case.
So is it a case of the old joke:
Q “Why are there no toilets in Conservative Central Office?”
A “Because everyone shits on everyone else”.
Why? In what way? Chucking out a couple of cheap words is not a good look. In a two party state the Tories have been the better option in every election I ever saw over the last 50+ years. That is not to say they are great, nor even competent, simply a better option than Labour have ever been. I’m a Reform member by the way.
The only difference between the two establishment parties is a matter of time.
Well done for seeing the light and joining Reform.
I largely agree with this however, I think there are 2 purposes of the culture wars:
1. It provides rewards & rallying points for intersectional groupings.
2. It’s a low cost way of creating clear red water between Labour & Tories, which, since economically they’re virtually indistinguishable, is a useful role.
Unfortunately, the Conservative Party just want to be another party that people can vote for. Just like another Supermarket that sells all of the same stuff as all the other Supermarkets. Roll up and get your Net Zero, your Gender Ideology, your Pack of Race Cards and your Multicultural Mass Immigration Dogma. To the current Conservative Party a real Conservative is an embarrassment (Braverman) and is ushered away out of the room.
I suggest using an upper case C to describe the party or else tge historically inaccurate but widely understood word Tories.
Always use a lower case c for the philosophy. Otherwise many voters and all journalists will be confused.
I thought the article was a bit banal. I would also point out that Mosley was not a Conservative as implied but a former bid wheel in Labour. A socialist.
Not sure I agree with you about the article. While I am in favour of the Reform Extra Strong as the author is, I can see that a less wordy and intellectual article is more helpful for stating the case than his more usual intellectual approach.
We have a number of important policies to support – to get rid of the Net Zero policy, start fracking, build on the Brexit successes which one does not hear about, leave the WHO, start building moreof the right type of houses that are needed, cut illegal immigration and start properly supporting marriage between biological men and women.
Don’t worry Baddenoch, if elected leader will promise you all of what you want if you will vote Tory – you won’t get it of course.
Conservatives – policy-matched with Labour.
Thucydides and Powell mentioned in this article remind me of many a remembered fact from Robert Shepherd’s excellent 700 page biography on the great man. Aged 17, Powell sat a three hour Greek scholarship paper for Trinity College, Cambridge. (He’d learned the language in two weeks as a fourteen year old). After an hour and a half, he’d completed the translation in the style of Thucydides and of that of Herodotus. He took first prize. I was musing which of the 650 occupants of the green benches of Westminster could hold a candle to his intellect, or indeed. prescience. Answers on a postcard—-.
Most of today’s bunch would probably demand a vaccine if they were told they had come into contact with Thucydides!
😃 😀 😀
On the money.
Ofcourse it depends on what you do with your intellect—–eg I believe Bill Clinton could do the Times Crossword in 4 minutes
He could do amazing stuff with a cigar in less.
And using hardly any intellect at all.
The electoral system is the school nativity play, but with the children replaced by adults and with the adults replaced by elites. At the end of the play they pat you on the head and tell you how well you played your role. Then they go home, forget about it, and thank their lucky stars it’ll be a while before they have to go through the boring inconvenience again.
While I have never been a member of the Conservative party, it seems to me that it has successfully reorganised itself internally over the years, while retaining the same name. After all, it is hard work to progress in the electoral system here, when a party splits into two and a new one tries to take over. Internal morphism while retaining the same name was more successful.
Successful for the MPs, not for their voters, not for conservatism nor for the country.
I keep saying this but 86% of those who voted supported parties other than Reform at the last election. So either 86% of those who voted are lefties (all parties other than Reform are left wing) or some proportion of them are terminally stupid. Either way, we are done for.
Yes and no. In the UK system voters have to look at the bundle of policies each party offers and make a decision on the basis of how attractive the bundle is to them on average. For example, there may well be a voter that a) receives some benefits or has a family member that does, and wants to retain these, b) is concerned about immigration levels, c) loves the idea of the NHS, d) doesn’t really like Nigel although thinks he does say some things that makes sense, e) always voted Labour.
At the next election immigration concerns are likely to be much worse than they are now, loves the NHS less as the failings become more evident, Nigel may not be leader any of Reform any more – maybe Suella is (!), has lots of friend that voted Reform in 2024 and may know of somebody in the community that was Gaoled by Starmer (TM).
Although you say that the Conservatives are left wing – their voters mostly aren’t and certainly don’t see themselves as such.
All the bundles are left wing – I would say even Reform’s is mainly left of centre. But I apparently have extremist political views.
Immigration is the number 1 red line for me because there’s no going back from it – we’re not going to start repatriating millions of people. If you voted for any of the lefty parties, including the Tories, then you either approve of immigration or don’t care that much about it or maybe you’re just so thick that you believe them when they say they will reduce it, despite the decades of actions in the opposite direction. Nut zero is the next red line for me – and again it seems like most people either believe the nonsense or somehow think it won’t affect them or that the government will backslide on the objectives. The third red line is health fascism, and even Reform were/are weak on that, which is why I voted ADF.
Reform will fade, the Tories will edge their way back in after 5 or 10 or 15 years, and the decline will continue and accelerate.
Let’s not kid ourselves, most people would consider our views insanely “right wing”. We are not going to get all we want and at this point I’d settle for a return to the socio political landscape of 1999.
That’s not going to happen of course, and I’d advise everybody who can to look into adaption strategies.
Personally I’m going to plow all my savings into expensive wine and hide it under the floor boards where Starmer can’t find it, then start drinking myself to death once I hit retirement. Shame that fois gras won’t keep /lol
I’m not quite retired and I’m doing the wine drinking bit already.
“Right wing” now means you’re Literally Hitler. I’m just for small government, liberty under the law, freedom of speech, private property rights. I’m not even that socially conservative – I mean I am in my own habits but have no interest in imposing that on other people – but at the same time I object to someone forcing me to call a man female – but the leftards think that means I want to put trannies into concentration camps.
There is a Restaurant in Madagascar out of the main city that does Fois Gras — I tried some the time before last. You can usually smell it in the air when passing by the road.
Whilst I agree with you on many a thing, I stand in a tiny minority (who believes in individual liberty and free markets) to say immigration is not the problem. The root cause is welfare and central planning
Welfare and central planning are huge problems, but they can be reversed. Once your country is full of foreigners, you’re finished – it just becomes a different country. Some might say the country will be better off for that, some the same on balance, some worse. But it surely won’t be the same country. We’re never going to have a pogrom of foreigners, so we’re done. But maybe you don’t mind it become a different country – which is of course a view you’re entitled to hold. I want it to remain the same (well, to go back to how it was) because it’s what I am used, and to a lesser extent because I think it’s just better than other countries. I’m a horrible racist because I think race exists and is deeply intertwined with cultures and a big factor in determining outcomes.
I wish they can be reversed. I’ve yet to see anyone materially want to tackle these.
Race and culture is not mutually exclusive. You could have people of different races sharing the same values and culture.
As you have said before and I do agree with a lot of what you say – if you are left alone and your life is not interfered with then others can do what they want. I suspect the issue (as it is in my eyes) is that you are being forced to follow a different set of values and culture
People of different races can share the same values and culture, but I’m not sure how meaningful that is. We are of course all different – just because I am English doesn’t mean I share exactly the same beliefs as every other Englishman. More meaningful IMO is that countries and regions differ greatly from one another culturally and racially and the two are deeply linked. If the UK was full of Chinese people it would just be China in the Channel.
I agree regarding “live and let live” but there is also the question of social mores – you grow up with social mores around you which you may not like but you get used to them, and so does everyone else, and you know what to expect, how to behave – it makes life a bit easier. Things like queueing. Introduce a lot of outsiders and that goes out of the window. I might be free as a bird in some foreign country but if I feel out of place then I won’t be happy.
There is a surprising commonality of moral values across many religions and societies around the world even if some have ritualistic practices which seem odd to outsiders.
There are also some barbaric exceptions and sadly for the UK some who espouse such beliefs have found their way to these shores.
Believing infidels should be put to the sword is just one example.
Moral values yes, social mores less so. I find Germans standoffish and rude – because I am not used to them. Some cultures don’t queue. Living with others is hard enough without throwing a lot of different social mores into the mix.
One can generalise about national characteristics and I agree some Germans have poor manners just as some Parisians can be downright obnoxious to foreigners.
Germany has some odd ideas about free speech and some fascistic laws to punish people who express political views which are not favoured by those in power.
The issue is that despite a considerable degree of migration into the UK over centuries, there has been considerable favourable assimilation of migrant populations [taking on the traits of the dominant culture to such a degree that the assimilating group becomes socially indistinguishable from other members of the society].
But there is something very different about some types of migrants in recent decades some sections of whom have not assimilated and whose social and moral values and behaviours are in conflict with others.
That is a problem.
Indeed
Many countries have odd ideas about free speech and fascistic laws to punish off-narrative views – including the UK
I find Japanese people delightful but I don’t want to be surrounded by them. I value racial and cultural diversity. I don’t want a homogenous global culture and race.
Once your country is full of foreigners, you’re finished Some bloke called Harald said something similar in 1066. Sadly it was one in the eye for him and he was finished then. Several centuries earlier all these bloody Italians were swarming all over the place building villas like they thought it was the Costa del Sol. In London now you can’t move for Johnny Foreigner. They are everywhere including second, third and fourth generation immigrant stock. Immigration subject to the resources to support it has not been a huge problem when the migrants and the indigenous have common values. That in general has been the case for centuries. Obviously, there was quite a hiatus between Protestants and Catholics after Henry VIII took control of the reins of Christianity. In those days it was impossible to fit a fag paper between politics and religion [and that was only partly because they did not have fag papers in those days]. The threats from foreign powers were bound up in religious affiliation – protestants or papists. Now we have different problems. We have communities in this country some of whom believe infidels should be put to the sword. It is a pretty short-sighted… Read more »
Indeed not all immigration is the same. But I think it all has to stop. I can’t think of a significant wave of immigration since the Normans – a thousand years ago – before the recent ones.
Hugenots, Jewish people, Irish, Carribean and West Indian people, Polish and other nationalities post WW2.
And lots lots more.
We have even let Scots into the country and that was an act of fair minded generosity going beyond the call of duty.
But I think we should deport all tool makers’ sons asap before the country really goes to shit.
Huguenots and Jews were surely small numbers as a proportion of overall population. I think pre WW2 were they not all a small proportion?
Pre WW2 the population was at least half what it is now.
And in C16 and 17 was far smaller yet. The influx of Hugenots from persecution in France was in relative terms substantial:
Interesting – it says 50,000 in England, which I have worked out is equivalent to 1,000,000 today – so yes, I agree it’s a large number, but there are close to 1,000,000 arriving every year here now and they are not Huguenots!
I wonder if the marvellously unvaxxed tennis player Pierre Hugues-Herbert is descended from Huguenots. He is I think from Alsace.
An Alsatian – woof, woof.
Jewish migration to these shores has a long history.
And that migration of course continued during various pogroms across Europe in Russia and elsewhere and during the 1930s persecution in Nazi Germany.
I’ve no doubt – but still think the numbers will be negligible compared to what we have seen since WW2, as a proportion of population.
Remember it was the smallest turnout in decades and most didn’t vote, because many, for good reason, see no salvation in voting, more on resisting in an individual way. Not waiting for some saviour who is just an illusion.
Turnout was around 60%. Who knows why the other 40% didn’t vote? Of course some because none of the parties standing were acceptable to them, many I would say because they didn’t care who won. I didn’t vote Reform as there was a better party standing where I live – had they not then I may have voted Reform as they were just about acceptable. There is of course no saviour but “resisting in an individual way” is not going to stop millions of immigrants arriving in the next 5 years.
There’s little hope.
The country is being destroyed in front of our eyes.
Yes, and there will be little joy in telling the white flight professional and managerial classes (who presently go along with much of the culture wars to keep/further their careers) we told you so, as their world too is turned upside down in so many ways.
It is not reasonable to conclude they are either leftie or stupid. Most people do not read Daily Sceptic or and of the other more free thinking sources.
There are still many people, for instance, who think the Tories made a lot of mistakes in 14 years. They believe a new leader will bring about a renaissance of conservatism and competence.
So you see most voters need a bit of suffering to encourage them to reconsider the long standing truths in their heads.
I guess it depends how you define stupid. Politically asleep maybe? How much suffering do they need? Anyway, we’re done for.
Political Sheep more like!
If they still believe that about the Tories then they are clueless, like a battered wife who keeps going back.
They may have seen Reform as incompetent or they did not believe Reform had much support in their area so their vote would be wasted. An election is not an opinion poll on issues.
Reform may have been incompetent in government but the Tories definitely were. Labour may be competent but if you don’t like their policies that is a bad thing not a good one.
An election poll surely has to be in part an opinion poll on issues.
Agree with most of what you’ve said in this thread – definitely agree with the wine drinking! – but I have to disagree with the fake Tories being incompetent. That bunch were extremely competent in playing their part in laying the foundations for voter-approved Marxism to be installed by the current bunch of elitist filth. Agree 100% with your original assessment though – we’re f*cked.
Yes good point – they made a good job of seeming incompetent at times but it may have often been deliberate.
Yes remember Suella said that Sunak *blocked* her from stopping the boats. Whether it was about the ECHR or turning they around in the sea, I can’t recall.
As I have posted many, many times, the Tories engaged in a controlled destruction of their own party. I will not reiterate the reasons why.
Well said. The Tories knew exactly what they were up to and anyone who cannot see that needs a reality check.
The only way I will vote Conservative at the next election is if they enter a pact with Reform, and Nigel tells me to vote for them.
If the Conservatives were to put country before party they should realise that Labour will win a majority at the next election too, unless they entered a pact with Reform, with each bowing out of constituencies where the other did better in 2024.
The best way of ousting Labour at the next election is if the new Tory leader comes from the centre right, but is pragmatic and prepared to enter a pact with Reform. That would be a better outcome than somebody purportedly on the right like Kemi or Jenrick coming in on a platform of ‘winning back the votes that went to Reform’. That’s a strategy that is bound to fail.
Of course, 4/5 years is an eternity in politics so who knows what the political scene will look like then. Labour could be seriously challenged by the Islamic parties. Reform might well have imploded.
I should add, a pact could result in a coalition government like they have in Sweden (the “Moderate party”; yes they are actually called that), between the centre right and the Reform party equivalent (“Sweden Democrat Party”).
What is the point of the Conservative Party if we have Reform?
Reform is for those who can’t stand the Tories. The Tories are for those who can’t stand Nigel. Basically.
It’s virtually the same in Sweden. The Sweden Democrats are viewed by the middle class as oiks, whereas the Moderates are for private sector middle class workers.
I imagine there’s an element of snobbery, yes. I’m a terrible snob but you couldn’t pay me enough to vote Tory.
Maybe when Agenda 2030 kicks in people won’t be so fussy and realise that this is a long planned agenda that the Tories & Labour have been following.
Reform is for those who trust none of the establishment parties.
If the Tories enter a pact with Reform then Reform is finished. Surely Farage will not trust that scum again as he did in 2016 “My job is done” and in 2019 standing down 317 candidates and effectively closing down all opposition to their treacheries.
I say again the Tory party is institutionally corrupt to its core – it sold out to the globalists years ago.
If the Tories stay where they are (politically), they will stay where they are, in opposition. As things stand right now, they are just another (of many) Socialist parties, almost all of their policies are Socialist, even if maybe Socialist-Lite! As long as they stay there, I will never again vote for them (assuming I vote at all). They will fail to win back the majority who shifted their vote to Reform, and quite likely leak even more votes to them. Reform are somewhat reminiscent of Conservatives under Thatcher, in that they actually possess mostly conservative policies, and that is what non Socialists want. If the votes received by Reform and Tories were combined (and I accept that is fairly crude and likely unrealistic) then Labour would not have fared anywhere nearly as well as they did, and we quite possibly would have had a hung parliament (metaphorical not actual). I did a few random checks and where Labour took Conservative seats, they would not have done so in the vast number of cases had Reform votes been taken by the Tories. In comparison, where Lib Dems took Tory seats, even with Reform votes, they would have still failed to… Read more »
They need to address the following:
Limits on all immigration
Abandon Net Zero
Plan to build new gas and nuclear power stations to create energy security
Complete Brexit
Stop all Woke policies
Get tough on real crime
Abolish the BBC, or scrap the license fee at the very least, force them to become commercially competitive.
Deport all criminal non-citizens – for real crimes, not speeding or parking offences etc.
Deport illegal immigrants.
Restore the true concept of justice, not the abomination we have under Labour
Stop all wind and solar
Scrap all climate related goals
Have policies that help farmers produce the food we need, with fair recompense.
Enforce truth in media
Enforce protected Freedom of Speech
Bring back all the treason laws and apply retrospectively to when they were scrapped
Abolish Blairs Supreme Court
Scrap current housing targets
Keep cash
And this is just a sample.
No more lockdowns, no more vaccine coercion
I quite like these few from the ADF
Find Out More About The Alliance For Democracy and Freedom Political Party Principles — Alliance for Democracy and Freedom Party (adfparty.uk)
Yes agree with all of those also, but to achieve food independence we need a 50% reduction in the population, due to our temperate climate and amount of arable land.
We should immediately cease sending weapons to Ukraine, and only send genuine humanitarian aid in the form of food, medicines, machinery to repair and build housing, schools, hospitals and infrastructure. Force Ukraine to sue for peace and the best deal they can get from Russia. Zelensky and his Nazi populated regime need to go.
I wish I knew more about everything, in this case about how much food we produce vs how much we eat. I know we export meat but also import it, think we may be more or less even there but probably not in other areas – rice being the obvious one. I don’t think it’s necessary to stop importing all good, just to be in as good a position as we can be if push comes to shove. Reducing the native population seems to be a political goal, combined with increasing the non-native population. Falling birth rates mean that if we had not imported so many tens of millions of non-Brits since WW2 we might be OK, but apparently we need cheap labour…
Encourage patriotism. Can you imagen Churchill rousing the masses with self hatred!
I took delivery of a red polo shirt last week which I had embroidered thus…
English Patriot.
It looks just the part in the pub.
While going through the Airport, I had my ‘Made in Chy-Na!’ Covid T-shirt on, some Chinese people saw it too Lol.
It beggars belief that the Not-a-Conservative-Party didn’t understand in May 2019 (when Nigel and the 6-week old Brexit Party won the final EU Parliament elections and drove the Tories down to less than 10%) that they either delivered Brexit or they would be obliterated.
In November 2019, when Nigel stood down half his candidates so Johnson could win a large majority, they were drinking in the Last Chance Saloon.
They are gutless, treacherous, liars and cowards. And the rump that remain are the worst of the lot since CCHQ had ensured that it was mostly the One Nation LibCONs in the safest of seats.
Not one of the 2nd-rate candidates to replace Sunak has what it takes.
The Leadership, guts and determination are found in Reform.
There is no Conservative Party.
When Labour turned Britain into a Socialist State in 1945, subsequent Conservative Governments just carried it on.
Margaret Thatcher denationalised some of it but left wealth redistribution via the tax system and thus State dependency in place, free market nominal not actual, and as part of the EU no free trade – free trade being at the heart of Conservatism and prosperity for all.
The so-called Conservative Party since Thatcher have not merely failed to protect British values, morals and manners but have actively undermined and trashed them.
It is impossible to define what the Conservative Party is in essence, what it stands for, what is its vision, its aims – I suppose destroy Britain and the British.
The phrase ‘clear blue water’ between it and Labour used to be said now it’s more like the murky, brown crud on top of a cesspit that washes over both.
2TK and thugs are rightly condemned for attack on freedom of speech, but that mob is only building on foundations laid by the so-called Conservatives.
England remains.
I am American bred,
I have seen much to hate here— much to forgive,
But in a world where England is finished and dead,
I do not wish to live.
— August 2024
Joshua Trevino.
I share this view.
I have read through all 47 comments and it is like being on Guido’s blog. It would appear that almost all posters believe that our politicians are acting independently. They are not. They are order takers. They are being run from elsewhere by the Davos Deviants as I tend to call them; a sort of mixture of bankers, WEFfers and pharma with a sprinkling of American deep state. I suspect the UK manager is T.Bliar.
Assuming that the political establishment can run this country independently is farcical and so therefore is any presumption that changing one cheek of the arse for the one next door is absurd.
It is conceivable that the election of 2024 will be the last ever in this country. Politics is over in the UK.
Our salvation will not arrive via the ballot box.
Almost all posters, I’m not one of them. I know who these parasites work for.
I glanced at the front page of the Telegraph this morning (I know, I know, but every other so-called newspaper in this country is useful only for tearing into neat squares and hanging on the nail in the privy), and I was immediately transported back to the seventies. What on earth happened to the changes of the following decade? I do know what happened from the nineties onwards, much of it explained by other commenters on here. One thing that does strike me is that the voters in the ‘red wall’ constituencies were definitely not looking for reconciliation, just as I now am not looking for reconciliation, or any sort of middle ground consensus, I am too bloody old for a start. If the Conservative politicians took a long hard look at those constituencies maybe, just maybe, the light might go on in their currently addled brains.
Why not just have Reform, and forget about the Conservative Party ? Two parties will only split the vote, and without Reform the Conservatives will backslide again. What is needed is a government that actually works, in the sense of improving life in the UK. Traditionally the Tories have been good at that, but since Blair they think winning is more important than working
I haven’t read all the article but it occurs to me the Conservative party should simply be Conservative. After Thatcher was forced out they contracted dementia. They no longer knew who or what they were supposed to be let alone who they represent.
The same is, of course, true of Labour, but they resorted to digging out their not so glorious past, polishing it and pretending it is different: twice. Today they pretend they are the Old Old Labour but they punish Pensioners. The Real Keir must be turning in his grave.
The bottom line is that the days of the two party system are over. Who, realistically, is going to vote for either in the next election? Two Tier has already lost most of the pathetic number of voters from the election. Wait until he hammers Pensioners and Students in the Budget. Wait until he announces sweeping taxes across the board in the budget.
Meanwhile, what do the Tories offer?
Dr David Starkey gave a brilliant speech recently about what the Conservative Party needs to do if they are to survive, be a strong opposition to the Left, and lure voters away from Reform:-
https://youtu.be/HikjNGAvHJo?si=nkl7ls_SRExs0kfy
The issue is, how many of us want to go back? Most certainly I never will and I can’t be the only one. They lied to me in 2019 on a massive scale and that can never be forgiven.
Agree, it’s increasingly difficult to put faith in someone who repeatedly talks the talk but then reverts to type once they’ve got into a position of power. I’m hoping that Reform will use the next couple of years to build a solid foundation and show via their speeches in the House, the way they vote etc that they’re the real deal. For the time being the Conservative Party (in name only) are a lost cause.
The Conservative Party? What a joke.