Elon Musk and Henry Kissinger on the War in Ukraine
At the beginning of October, Elon Musk put forward a peace plan for Ukraine. The plan came, like so many of Musk’s ideas, in the form of a Twitter poll:

It was not warmly received. In a particularly memorable tweet, Ukraine’s then-ambassador to Germany said, “Fuck off is my very diplomatic reply to you.”
Criticism focused on the first two points: that Russia’s sham referendums be redone under UN supervision, and that Crimea be formally recognised as part of Russia. Perhaps understandably, many Ukrainians and their Western supporters were indignant at the prospect of giving up any territory in exchange for peace.
Musk was told that “you clearly don’t understand the subject”, and it’s good that “you’re not in politics”.
Unlike Musk, one figure who cannot be said to lack understanding of international politics is Henry Kissinger. A veteran of the Cold War, he was ranked as the “most effective U.S. Secretary of State of the past 50 years” in a poll of scholars taken in 2015.
Writing in the Spectator recently, Kissinger outlined a peace plan remarkably similar to Musk’s – though with one key difference.
In May of this year, Kissinger notes, “I recommended establishing a ceasefire line along the borders existing where the war started on February 24th. Russia would disgorge its conquests thence, but not the territory it occupied nearly a decade ago, including Crimea.” He goes on:
If the pre-war dividing line between Ukraine and Russia cannot be achieved by combat or by negotiation, recourse to the principle of self-determination could be explored. Internationally supervised referendums concerning self-determination could be applied to particularly divisive territories which have changed hands repeatedly over the centuries.
In other words, Kissinger endorses both of Musk’s first two points – the ones that attracted so much ire on Twitter. Where Kissinger parts company with Musk is the issue of neutrality.
The war, he writes, “has mooted the original issues regarding Ukraine’s membership in NATO”. And as a result, “the alternative of neutrality is no longer meaningful”. (This represents a contrast with the view he took back in 2014.)
At the present time, of course, the prospect of any such deal being negotiated looks extremely remote. In a recent interview John Mearsheimer told Freddie Sayers: “There’s no deal to be worked out” so “both sides are going to fight this one out”. Further escalation, he observed, is “likely”.
The only circumstances where it seems possible a deal would be done is if the U.S. pressured Ukraine to accept one by threatening to withhold military aid. And that doesn’t seem very likely. So the conflict will probably drag on until one or both sides are exhausted.
If Kissinger believes there still is scope for negotiations, more detail on how to get there would be nice.
Stop Press: Niall Ferguson has written an article for Bloomberg U.K. in which he reflects on other aspects of Henry Kissinger’s Spectator essay on how to avoid another world war.
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The war aim of Putin is clear:
The ‘de-europeanisation’ of Eastern Ukraine.
We know this because he has told us, repeatedly.
We also know, from intelligence intercepts, that Moldova is also to be ‘de-europeanised’
Repeated signed assurances from Russia regarding Ukraine’s territorial integrity have been abrogated.
Consequently no future treaty signed by Russia can have any credibility.
Where does this end?
In the short to medium term, it doesn’t. That is why Poland has ordered 1250 tanks.
This only ends once a demilitarized zone is set up on the Ukraine/Russia border and the conditions for that can only be achieved by Ukrainian arms.
Are you really characterising Putin’s declaration to de-nazify Ukraine as de-europeanisation?
That says a lot about your view of life in the EU.
I characterize nothing. Putin regards denazification and de-europeanisation as one and the same.
Monro is most likely a paid member of the 77th & gets a payment for every like/dislike & a bigger one for every reply. the best way to deal with the likes of him is to not engage in the first place.
Monro represents the majority view of this country regarding Putin’s invasion of Ukraine.
‘Not engaging’ but attempting to discredit is the fashionable lazy way to debate: socialist fascism.
Since when has consensus made an argument other than popular. It does not make it right, especially when the story is told in a one-sided fashion.
Entirely missing the point.
Either come up with some cogent arguments, evidence or do us all a big favour and cease posting comments that contribute precisely nothing.
I only do it for fun No-one takes him or her seriously.
My comment above refers.
He has his furrow to plough, and he ploughs it incessantly.
My comment above refers.
This war started in 2006… and escalated in 2014…to escalate again in 2021 to actual military action.
In the battle between good and evil, let me give you a clue. We’re not the good guys…
This war started in 1918, if not before.
You are entitled to your opinion.
It is not one that I share.
Ukraine voted for independence in 1991, majorities in all regions including Crimea.
We have guaranteed Ukraine’s territorial integrity.
This is not some childish ‘good and evil’ debate.
There are no ‘good’ sides in war.
But the people of Ukraine have made clear their wishes. They are fighting for their independence and we are committed by international agreement to stand by them.
“we are committed by international agreement to stand by them.”
The rule of law both domestically and internationally has been deliberately and blatantly flouted these last three years. It has been disregarded as puppet governments have been directed. The rule of law is only relevant if it suits the purposes of the ‘elites.’ To all intents it is a fiction and exists in name only.
International law, with its reliance on vaguely-specified levels and combinations of state practice and opinio juris, renders the existence and content of international legal norms highly indeterminate, thereby violating the rule of law demand for notice and clarity (Goldsmith & Posner 2005).
Moreover, the process of reforming customary international law over time, which may involve states contravening existing customary norms in order to give rise to new norms, violates the rule of law requirement of congruence between law and official behaviour.
Greater fidelity to the rule of law requires that treaty law regimes should increasingly displace customary law.
‘The United States of America, the Russian Federation, and the United Kingdom of Great Britain and Northern Ireland, reaffirm their commitment to seek immediate United Nations Security Council action to provide assistance to Ukraine, as a non-nuclear-weapon State Party to the Treaty on the Non-Proliferation of Nuclear Weapons, if Ukraine should become a victim of an act of aggression…’
Budapest Memorandum 1994
You sound vaccinated 🤣
I have been vaccinated many, many times but not since 1990.
So just to be clear, do you mean that in the battle between good and evil Putin’s lot are the good guys?
Western Governments seem to be quite keen on the de-europeanisation of Europe to be fair. Via mass immigration whether the native population want it or not.
Any peace agreement would likely have to be overseen by a non western power such as China or possibly Turkey, however I doubt that would be acceptable to the US. Therefore I find it difficult to see how any peace agreement could be concluded and the war will continue until one or both sides are exhausted.
You make a good point, and de-europeanisation need not be all bad. Consider Brexit.
There have been plenty of U.N. policed buffer zones dotted around the place:
UNFICYP
UNDOF
UNEF 2
UNIFIL
However a buffer zone may very well have to be set up in unilateral agreement with Ukraine, once that country’s pre 2014 borders have been regained through force of arms, since no agreement with Russia will be worth the paper that it is written on.
Best of luck to any former Ukrainians who would vote to return themselves to the control of a regime who has presided over the destruction of its own country, the cancellation of democracy, the flight of around 20% of the population and the decimation (or worse) of the male population.
At least one million Russians have emigrated.
At least 100,000 Russian soldiers have been rendered hors de combat or dead, hundreds more today.
And how is democracy doing in Russia?
Oh yes. They put a lethal biological agent in your underpants if you oppose the regime.
So the Ukrainians will continue to resist, and anyone with even half a brain can see that, ultimately, they cannot lose.
Democracy is doing rather better in Russia over the last 20 years than in Ukraine (I know Russians who still live there).
One million (if your figures are correct) is a miniscule proportion from the nearly 150,000,000 people who inhabit Russia compared with 20% from Ukraine.
I challenge your figures for dead and wounded Russians. What is your source? It can only be Western press who do not cover the hundreds every day who involuntarily become ex-Ukrainians, the photos of Ukrainian cemeteries tend to underline that.
Loving the humour. There is no credible democracy in Russia.
Regarding Russian casualties, it would be a challenge if you came up with referenced alternative figures but you cannot.
‘Over 90,000 Russian soldiers have died, cannot be accounted for, or have suffered such serious injuries that they are unable to return to service, independent Russian media project iStories reports, citing sources close to the Kremlin’
Moscow Times 16 Oct 22
Kissinger is not a good guy. Apart from being Schwab’s sponsor at the WEF, he is responsible for a large part of the death, damage and destruction caused by aggressive Western military policies in the Middle East and elsewhere. He is interested in a bigger game, and to him Ukraine is merely a side a show. If America were sufficiently determined, then it should be possible to go for a ceasefire and neutrality deal in Ukraine, although after all the history whether Russia would believe that the West’s intentions could this time be taken seriously is a moot point.
Ukraine will never take a Russian signature on any treaty seriously.
After Afghanistan, the Democrats have to stand firm alongside Ukraine.
The battlefield has not yet frozen. A lot will become clearer after winter is over.
I wasn’t defending Kissinger, just pointing out that Musk’s proposal can’t be dismissed on the grounds that he “doesn’t understand the subject” – given that Kissinger (who does understand the subject, whether he has good intentions or not) made a similar proposal.
“Kissinger is not a good guy.”
He is and always has been a very dangerous individual and a blot on humanity. The world will be a better place when he croakes, albeit only slightly.
https://deathlist.net/
He’s at number 2.
Good on Musk for at least getting some people to think outside the war mindset and consider what peace in the region might look like. The geo-political details can evolve but there has to be a will to move in that direction, otherwise this will be interminable slaughter. The problem is this crazy, paranoid world no longer values honourable things like peace. It’s all hubris, lies, greed, brainless hatred, and geo-political games. Still, I’m encouraged that 41% agreed with the idea of a resolution.
It also seems unlikely that Ukraine will be at all interested in negotiations when their intercept intelligence reveals the following: ‘…on the eve of the winter offensive of the Armed Forces of Ukraine, it is almost impossible to provide the Armed Forces of Ukraine with some more significant service than killing the remnants of our infantry and the remnants of our tanks. Although no, I’m sorry. We can! “…..rifle regiments” without heavy weapons and artillery, the same state as the regiments of the Donbass “mobiks”. These absolutely uncontrollable due to the lack of proper command personnel and, of course, the lack of communications, units are simply created in order to devour the human resource and do not represent any combat value. They are simply created for the Armed Forces of Ukraine to locate them by the clusters of constantly turned-on cell phones, listen to their analog “Baofengs” radios and strike precisely at them….’ Russian volunteer ‘Murz’ ‘The Russian army is experiencing a serious shortage of ammunition against the backdrop of active supplies of ammunition to our enemy, this problem is turning from serious to critical. If nothing changes, in the near future the enemy will begin to gain artillery dominance… Read more »
Thanks, Munro, for supplying an alternative perspective in your comments to this article.
Thanks. Odd that my stance opposing a totalitarian dictator guilty of invading a democratic capitalist neighbouring country (and egregious war crimes) should be a minority view on here.
Strange times.
But then Putin’s largesse buys a lot of support from oddballs and their silly little organisations all over Europe.
Thanks Munro.
You’re right, it’s v odd indeed. After all, it’s possible to think BOTH that the West’s record on covid, net zero, and wokism (through varying degrees of stupidity, incompetence, and corruption) is appalling AND that it nonetheless can’t just allow Putin to take over parts of Eastern Europe. My hope is that the silent majority of DS readers broadly agree, but who knows in these strange times!
However, not sure what you mean by “Putin’s largesse buys a lot of support from oddballs and their silly little organisations all over Europe.” Care to elaborate?
‘We should not forget that, across western Europe, Putin has paid and ideological allies working to undermine the foundations of liberal democracy and human rights from within. The work of these European far-right politicians and anti-gender civil society actors in furthering Russian objectives – whether or not they are aware they are doing so – is why we should be worried by Moscow’s financial influence. Once the war in Ukraine is over, these useful idiots of Russia will still be among us.’
‘Open Democracy’ 06 April 22
Listening to The Duran, which imo provides an alternative to the government approved MSM agenda, the suggestion seems to be that Russia is slowly but surely grinding away at the Ukrainian military and successfully “de-militarizing” Ukraine (one of its stated objectives). Apparently Russia has recognized that any kind of deal/agreement with the west cannot be trusted and presumes negotiations with the west/Ukraine are in bad faith. There also seems to be a suggestion that Russia is gearing up for a large offensive.
If indeed that is the case then it doesn’t matter what Elon or Henry or anyone else have to say about a negotiated peace. As far as the Russians are concerned that boat has sailed (Minsk 1, 2, Istanbul). The Russians are going to solve this themselves: there will be no lasting solution with their “western partners” and they will have to prevail militarily.
The end result will be annexation of a large part of Ukraine and a neutral buffer zone to provide strategic depth for Russia. Let’s see if it plays out like this… an alternative is we all get turned to glass as the nukes start flying… :p
The Duran is a paid shill for the Russians. And one half of The Duran is a debarred lawyer who was convicted of fraud. Listen to them if you like, but realise who pays them to say what they say.
Do you have any evidence of this?
The Duran website is part of DRN Media PLC, a company registered in Cyprus.
Alexander Mercouris (in 2012 disbarred as a barrister in London) the editor in chief of The Duran, is also a Sputnik commentator. According to the registers, there are four associates of DRN Media: Mercouris, Vladimir Rodzianko, Peter Lavelle and Alex Christoforou. They are aligned with pro-Kremlin outlets.’
‘Alexander Mercouris concocted a web of “tortuous deceit” to convince a client he was pursuing the bogus claim, including forging a Supreme Court judge’s signature, a tribunal heard….’
‘Dr. Vladimir Zeetser, owns a minority share of DRN Media, the company behind the Duran, a website promoting false conspiracy theories echoing Russian state messaging. He was added to the company’s board of directors in 2018. Zeetser has met with other shareholders of the Duran in Moscow and frequently espouses pro-Kremlin talking points in his personal social media posts on Instagram, LinkedIn, and Facebook. Zeetser recently wrote, “Anyone who supports the current regime in [Kyiv] supports Nazism plain and simple.”
‘Overall, we rate The Duran as a Questionable source based on far-right-wing bias, promotion of Russian propaganda, right-wing conspiracies, a lack of transparency, use of poor sources, plagiarism’
‘Media Bias’
“They are aligned with pro-Kremlin outlets” does not make them paid shills.
You are entitled to your opinion.
Nevertheless Zeetser’s lifestyle is extravagant……..
DRN Media banks in Cyprus to avoid scrutiny……
Vladimir Rodzianko is based in Moscow……
None of this is, of course, evidence.
Nevertheless, if it walks like this kind of duck, I certainly wouldn’t be using the duran as an trusted source…..
Germany was fighting General Patton in WWII and not General, Milley Vanilli and his queer battalions. Backed up by a decrepit CIC Rssident Biden. The Germans didn’t listen to Trump and look what happened.
just a small point – isn’t mr Kissinger about 900 years old? This photograph appears to be of a man in early middle age.
Many on here complain, rightly, about the British government’s use of propaganda etc over the last three years. Yet many of those same people trot out nonsense propaganda from Russia. Why not, instead, listen to real Russian soldiers and what they are saying: ‘Mobilisation has completely failed. It should be understood that the vast majority – 70-80% of the mobilised military personnel turned out to be unfit for combat for several reasons: 1. Lack of quality military training. Here I don’t see the point in ranting, I can only say that if yesterday’s cashier from the grocery store is driven around in a tank at the training ground for 2 weeks, then he obviously won’t become a good tankman. 2. The lack of ideological motivation of the mobilised due to the lack of clear goals of the SMO, which should be broadcast by the authorities and the media. Yesterday’s factory worker has no idea what denazification and demilitarization of brotherly Ukraine is (I don’t quite understand either). Obviously, these magical and abstract expressions are not the reason why a hard worker will go to war for the denazification of brotherly Ukraine with a smile on his face… Read more »
It seem Musk and Kissinger are wrong about this in my opinion.