Do Online Opinion Polls Overestimate Public Support For Covid Restrictions?

We’re publishing an original essay today by regular contributor Mike Hearn about the problem of ‘pro-social bias’ in online opinion polls. What this means is that the huge public support for the Covid restrictions revealed in opinion polls for YouGov and others is likely to be overstated. Here is an extract:

Online panel polling solves the problem of low phone response rates but introduces a new problem: the sort of people who answer surveys aren’t normal. People who answer an endless stream of surveys for tiny pocket-money sized rewards are especially not normal, and thus aren’t representative of the general public. All online panel surveys face this problem and thus pollsters compete on how well they adjust the resulting answers to match what the ‘real’ public would say. One reason elections and referendums are useful for polling agencies is they provide a form of ground truth against which their models can be calibrated. Those calibrations are then used to correct other types of survey response too.

A major source of problems is what’s known as ‘volunteering bias’, and the closely related ‘pro-social bias’. Not surprisingly, the sort of people who volunteer to answer polls are much more likely to say they volunteer for other things too than the average member of the general population. This effect is especially pronounced for anything that might be described as a ‘civic duty’. While these are classically considered positive traits, it’s easy to see how an unusually strong belief in civic duty and the value of community volunteering could lead to a strong dislike for people who do not volunteer to do their ‘civic duty’, e.g. by refusing to get vaccinated, disagreeing with community-oriented narratives, and so on.

In 2009 Abraham et al showed that Gallup poll questions about whether you volunteer in your local community had implausibly risen from 26% in 1977 to a whopping 46% in 1991. This rate varied drastically from the rates reported by the U.S. census agency: in 2002 the census reported that 28% of American adults volunteered.

Worth reading in full.

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Hugh
Hugh
4 years ago

Who is it owns Yougov again?

Rogerborg
4 years ago
Reply to  Hugh

I believe that the mostly-peaceful Zahawi has sold his interests, on paper, although having experience working for mostly-peaceful-run businesses, that doesn’t mean that he’s not still controlling it in reality.

Hopeless
4 years ago
Reply to  Rogerborg

“Blind trusts”; a mechanism beloved of politicians?

Andy R
Andy R
4 years ago
Reply to  Hugh

BlackRock and Standard life Abderdeen (owned by the Liberty Acquisition Holdings (International) Company (a vehicle controlled by billionaire Nicolas Berggruen).
Here he is on the WEF site….
https://www.weforum.org/people/nicolas-berggruen
Ipsos Mori is a WEF partner.
All things lead to WEF and a bunch of controlling billionaires set on owning the world including you, your body, your mind and your soul.

Lucan Grey
4 years ago

Of course they do.

How many here have consented to polling recently?

Yougov panels are stuffed full of precisely the sort of hysterical people who think they are important yet they are actually the root cause of all the problems.

Once again it is all a subset of marketing. Mind manipulation and propaganda. Government listens to the gullible and those that ‘make themselves available’, precisely because it is easier to do that than do the legwork to get a proper feel.

Arguably we only have ourselves to blame. In a world where marketing is all that matters, the unmarketed are invisible.

John
4 years ago
Reply to  Lucan Grey

I occasionally get yougov polls, but when the question doesn’t provide the answer that I want to give, usually the negative, I have ignored them. The options are loaded towards the answer they want, with don’t know being the only opposite option.

Rogerborg
4 years ago
Reply to  Lucan Grey

I signed up to WuGov, and the “polls” I’ve received so far are mostly market segmentation, and determining political loyalties. Since I’ve been answering those randomly (I’m a black-white child-pensioner who supports and hates Football United and making between £0 – £10,000,000 a year) I’ve yet to be invited to participate in any actual polling.

It’s almost as though they need to be sure of the responses before asking for them.

John Dee
4 years ago
Reply to  Rogerborg

(I’m a black-white child-pensioner who supports and hates Football United and making between £0 – £10,000,000 a year)

And there I was, worried that I might be the only confused-on-demand person on here!

Baron_Jackfield
4 years ago
Reply to  Lucan Grey

I’ve been telephone-polled a couple of times recently. After being asked my age (70+) and my educational background (post-grad) I’ve been told that, amazingly, my cohort is already over-subscribed in the survey and the call politely terminated.

Am I being cynical in thinking that they just want to get the opinions of the young and uneducated?

Mike Hearn
Editor
4 years ago

I think that has a simpler explanation – the elderly are more likely to answer telephone polls. One of the reasons phone polling has been in decline for a long time is the difficulty of reaching new generations who only use mobile phones and who frequently reject calls from any number they don’t recognize. As such I’d expect telephone polls to constantly be reaching too many people in older age brackets, and struggling to fill the necessary quotas of younger people. And that is of course legitimate because the goal is to get a representative sample of the population, not just people who pick up the phone.

karenovirus
4 years ago
Reply to  Mike Hearn

Now in my mid 60s I cancelled my landline some 15 years ago, not out of ideology or dogma, but because it was redundant given that I live in one of the few areas then serviced by Telewest Broadband (now part of Virgin, also since dismissed) which meant I did not have to piggyback off a BT landline to get broadband. I am unlikely to be invited to take part in a YouGov survey despite having two active mobile devices.

As a young twentysomething I was heavily involved in the earliest days of telemarketing as it was then known, even got interviewed by the FT, photo included, as to how it all worked.
One big fiddle is not what I told them.

One particular campaign the agency I worked for was promoting a timeshare development in Israel.
The target telephone contact list included the highly classified details of one of the directors own Synagogue congregation which included widowed survivors of the holocaust.
Mostly elderly, horrified at unknown persons (us) having their names, phone numbers and addresses.

Need I say more.

karenovirus
4 years ago
Reply to  karenovirus

Continued. Missed the 15 minute Editing deadline.

During my meteoric rise to tele Telesales Stardom I would have to train my pre minimum wage staff to indicate on the pen & paper response sheet to write
“Unco-operative” rather than “he told me to f*ck off” which usually accounted for 10-15% of the completed questionnaires that the client was paying for, no matter how well known their brands were.

Andy R
Andy R
4 years ago
Reply to  Mike Hearn

They can use weighting to adjust across age brackets. But when you start to adjust for the population you can accidentally bring in all sorts of bias.

karenovirus
4 years ago

Young and ill-educated, mis-educated if that’s a word, mal-educated perhaps.

Andy R
Andy R
4 years ago

The young and schooled methinks!

emel
emel
4 years ago

I thought the idea was you came up with the results you wanted, and then found people who gave you the right answer – just like all government research.

Baron_Jackfield
4 years ago
Reply to  emel

“Policy-based evidence-making” has replaced the traditional “evidence-based policy-making”.

NeilofWatford
4 years ago

So let’s balance the scales.
How does one sign up to participate in such polls?
Direct democracy. Local action – national impact.

Rogerborg
4 years ago
Reply to  NeilofWatford

https://account.yougov.com/gb-en/join/main

Be aware that you won’t be given access to any actual political polls until you’ve satisfied them that you have the correct sort of opinions.

dazren
dazren
4 years ago
Reply to  Rogerborg

Agreed. I am signed up to YouGov. Got a survey about COVID-19 this morning but I am not very often asked about my political opinions. I mainly get invitations to complete surveys on marketing nonsense.

Jane G
Jane G
4 years ago
Reply to  dazren

Me too. I signed up to YouGov in order to redress the balance but they soon sussed me out and started sending only dull things about TV streaming services.

Samurai Jack
Samurai Jack
4 years ago

Just needed to add this in..

Wifey been away for a weekend with friends , text me last night as one of the friends brothers, has been rushed to hospital and is now on his way to Royal London after the first stage thrombectamy operation wasn’t successful..

He had the moderna jab on Friday and regularly competed in Iron Man challenges

As it was last night, paralysed and clots

Cecil B
Cecil B
4 years ago
Reply to  Samurai Jack

‘paralysed and clots’

Like the country then

Crimson Avenger
4 years ago
Reply to  Cecil B

Paralysed BY clots.

cornubian
4 years ago
Reply to  Samurai Jack

They are coming up with all sorts of supposed reasons to explain away, and normalise, the sudden rise in heart problems. Why do you think that is?

photo_2021-11-29_08-24-58.jpg
Bella Donna
4 years ago
Reply to  cornubian

Its definitely caused the new improved Omnicron mutant! /sarc

ComeTheRevolution
ComeTheRevolution
4 years ago
Reply to  cornubian

This was always the plan. Covid (which in reality doesnt even exist and has not been proven to exist) is plausible deniability for state murder maiming and genocide and the rollout of the genetic injection programme which only causes harm. This has been the case since they started fast tracking people to ventilators and dosing them up with Midazolam and Morphine. Now they say it causes heart issues, when we all know its the injections that cause this. We need to burn this crap to the ground with truth. “Honest” John O Looney the funeral director gave this amazing interview recently. In his first interviews he confirmed there was no Covid early on and that the whole thing was orchestrated way before this crap reached the news. The hospitals were prepped months in advance for the scamdemic. They had to be primed, to be pumped with fear and drilled for compliance. I know in Aus the nurses are on gagging orders, any one know if they are here too. O Looney calls out Stooge Starmer for his role in crushing a criminal investigation into Jimmy Savile when he was head of the Crown Prosecution Service. We have to do EVERYTHING… Read more »

ComeTheRevolution
ComeTheRevolution
4 years ago

The Chinese Communist Party’s Global Lockdown Fraud https://ccpgloballockdownfraud.medium.com/the-chinese-communist-partys-global-lockdown-fraud-88e1a7286c2b 3. Deadly Recommendations for Early Mechanical Ventilation Came from China In early March 2020, the WHO released COVID-19 provider guidance documents to healthcare workers.[44] The guidance recommended escalating quickly to mechanical ventilation as an early intervention for treating COVID-19 patients, a departure from past experience during respiratory-virus epidemics.[45] In doing so, they cited the guidance being presented by Chinese journal articles, which published papers in January and February claiming that “Chinese expert consensus” called for “invasive mechanical ventilation” as the “first choice” for people with moderate to severe respiratory distress,[46] in part to protect medical staff. As the Wall Street Journal later reported: Last spring, doctors put patients on ventilators partly to limit contagion at a time when it was less clear how the virus spread, when protective masks and gowns were in short supply. Doctors could have employed other kinds of breathing support devices that don’t require risky sedation, but early reports suggested patients using them could spray dangerous amounts of virus into the air, said Theodore Iwashyna, a critical-care physician at University of Michigan and Department of Veterans Affairs hospitals in Ann Arbor, Mich.At the time, he said, doctors and… Read more »

Mark
4 years ago
Reply to  Samurai Jack

Always happened all the time. Why, I can’t remember a night out back in the pre-covid days when someone’s brother didn’t get rushed to hospital with a coronary or cerebral blood-related problem. I guess we all got so used to it we didn’t even notice it…

8bit
8bit
4 years ago
Reply to  Samurai Jack

Was chatting with a friend a couple of days ago. His best friend (physio teacher, sporty fit, no previous health problems, unless you count a bad marriage) was in hospital beginning of November with chest pains and fatigue. Had to stop work. He returned to hospital last week for a scan & tests. Diagnosis was coronary thrombosis. Not sure if surgical intervention is required. He’s double injected and stonily refuses to even consider his predicament is due to the mRNA juice.

John Dee
4 years ago
Reply to  8bit

One of the mRNA juice’s active ingredients must be a ‘suspension of disbelief’ tincture.

Judy Watson
Judy Watson
4 years ago
Reply to  Samurai Jack

Sorry to hear that. I hope some-one fills in the yellow card for him.

But I wonder why would such a fit sounding man have the jab in the first place?

stewart
4 years ago

Politicians would thus be well advised to treat these polls with enormous degrees of caution. Imposing draconian and violent policies on their own citizens because they incorrectly believe that fanatically devoted volunteers are representative of a Rousseau-ian ‘general will’ could very easily backfire.

Backfire? Really? When? How?

I really can’t wait.

Beowa
4 years ago

YouGov selects it’s respondents to give the result the people commissioning the poll want
Their daily chat polls are frequently different as people can self select to take part

karenovirus
4 years ago

As soon as they use the word ‘adjust’ any meaning a poll migh have had disappears since ‘adjust’ = Manipulate.

Aged about 11 or 12 I and a small group of friends gathered together with clipboards and pens to ask passing shoppers their opinion about proposals to put a link road from that corner to the bottom of the M1 motorway some three miles away.
Our sole intention was to create alarm and distress which could be enhanced by using words such as ‘drive’, ‘force’ or ‘compulsory purchase’.

We were generally satisfied with the results but baffled by a number of respondents who claimed to know all about the scheme which was completely figment of our imagination.

Rogerborg
4 years ago
Reply to  karenovirus

You crazy kids and your wacky hijinks.

Rogerborg
4 years ago

WuGov.

Riddle me this. Why would our enemies, the Mandarin Empire, not long since have captured and controlled all major online Western polls?

Do they lack the manpower? (They have tens of millions of surplus males with nothing to do except military service, and psy-ops is military service).

Are they not technologically capable (where was the device you are reading this with made?)

Are they too ethical (joke answer).

Really, I’d want to see the evidence that they’re not deciding what “we” think at this point.

cornubian
4 years ago

The fraud and deception is not as subtle as described above. It is as simple as a poll employee pressing a few buttons to cancel out votes for one side of the debate and adding imaginary votes to the other, as can be seen from these screenshot of last weeks YouGov poll that supposedly found the public in favour of locking up the uninjected and forced injections. At 10,810 votes – 82% were against these measures but at 12,922 votes 70% were in support of the measures. This is not mathematically possible and can only arise from vote manipulation. Moreover, the final YouGov press release said the result arose from a ‘sample’ of 1600 votes, so they were seemingly selective in which votes they picked to represent the result ie discounting thousands of opposing votes..

photo_2021-11-29_07-53-31.jpg
TheBluePill
4 years ago
Reply to  cornubian

I’ve never participated in one of these polls, but a comment on here rang the alarm bells for me some months ago. Someone queried why there was a sprinkling of inane questions mixed in with serious questions, such as “which way do you face when in the shower”.

It is very difficult to fake data in a way that cannot be detected with techniques such as Benfords law – something that the US has used to criticize foreign elections (while censoring the anomalies in the last US election). So what I expect they do instead is switch the questions around in their data sets, avoiding the fraud markers that would occur by tampering with the raw data. Ask a stupid question that gives an result such as 75% face towards the shower and just change the question and answer into “should the filthy unvaxxed be sent to the gas chamber?”, 75% say yes.

John Dee
4 years ago
Reply to  TheBluePill

While not presuming to claim any ‘expertise’ in personal hygiene, could I suggest that those who don’t expose all sides of their person to the showerhead aren’t doing it properly?

Mike Hearn
Editor
4 years ago
Reply to  cornubian

That’s addressed in the article. You’re talking about YouGov Chat which is a different thing to the polls YouGov announce, and in which you’re grouped according to earlier questions.

I think it’s fair enough to criticize the Chat platform but it’s not the source of the claims being made about support for mandates in the population. Chat is basically a form of entertainment as far as I can tell – those claims about what the public truly believe come from normal polling techniques like those used for elections.

Andy R
Andy R
4 years ago
Reply to  Mike Hearn

Mike – I work at one of the largest market research companies and the WEF Ideology is right at it’s very heart and right at it’s very top. If you really think polling companies can be trusted then look no further than the pre election polling for Trump v Clinton. Companies like Ipsos think they are the vanguard of some new corporate morality. It’s really quite grotesque. If you don’t think politics is at the heart of polling companies think again. These companies are basically WEF owned and have done very well thank you during the pandemic.
One of the key techniques used is framing. Even had an article on the WEF site about it (which they took down pronto) – Here it is on the wayback machine.

https://web.archive.org/web/20210907145424/https://www.weforum.org/agenda/2021/09/how-can-framing-decisions-impact-the-issue-of-vaccination-passports/

amanuensis
4 years ago

Even if the surveys were true, there’s no point in asking people about complex scientific stuff if they have no knowledge in the area.

This is tenfold true if they’ve been subjected to 12+ months worth of propaganda and misinformation.

I find it remarkable how many people believe that the answer is ‘more of what the government has been doing’ given that things appear to only get worse, not better.

stewart
4 years ago
Reply to  amanuensis

It is astonishing.

Every single thing the government had done has been an abject failure.

Lockdowns, fail. Masks, fail. Testing, fail. Jabs, fail.

But I guess it’s the sunk cost fallacy. As a society we’ve been forced to invest so much into government anti-covid policies, we just can’t bring ourselves to say – oh to hell with it all, it nothing works, let’s just scrap it all and go back to living the way we did in 2019.

FrankFisher
4 years ago
Reply to  stewart

BBC told us this morning that what we needed to do now was continue the tactics “that had served us well during the pandemic”. Without evidence, naturally. It’s SUCH a simple question. If all this shit works, then WHY are there more deaths this year than last year?

karenovirus
4 years ago
Reply to  FrankFisher

As yesterday, vaxs 1 & 2 didn’t work, neither has boosts thus far so obviously the answer is more vaxxes.

Nobel Prizes for Science and Medicine in the post please.

John Dee
4 years ago
Reply to  amanuensis

asking people about complex scientific stuff

Q: Are you in favour of nuclear fusion?
A: Is it available yet in this area?

karenovirus
4 years ago
Reply to  John Dee

This is not a lie, screenshot available upon request.
Just yesterday searching for AA Duracell batteries an Amazon customer asks

“Are batteries included?”

One of the politer responders writes
‘A somewhat puzzling question as you are buying batteries. Yes they are included’.

DevonBlueBoy
DevonBlueBoy
4 years ago
Reply to  karenovirus

The UK’s education system is obviously as wonderful as our police force and the NHS. All of which are the envy of the world.

DevonBlueBoy
DevonBlueBoy
4 years ago
Reply to  amanuensis

Einstein’s definition of idiocy: doing the same thing over and over again and expecting a different result

karenovirus
4 years ago

Main Regional Hospital Saturday, arrived by taxi in howling gale 07.30 for 08.05 CT scan. General Reception was completely deserted but a kindly member of the public pushed me in a wheelchair to X-Ray Dept. Nobody questioned my lack of mask or my vax status. The single other patient and partner were likewise barefaced. The scan went as expected and one of the non medical staff pushed me back to Reception where I had 40 minutes to wait for a taxi. I observed as several members of staff arriving for work blithely ignored the solitary sanitizer station while gormless members of the public wandered in through the wrong side of the wide entrance doors ignoring the large No Entry signs ⛔ and direction ⬇️ arrows 🔃 on the floor. Some ostentatiously donned fancy face masks as they walked past the sanitizer while others didn’t bother with either. Main Reception was by now fully staffed and there were Friends Of The Hospital volunteers scattered about none of whom took the slightest interest in this lack of Covid Safety indiscipline. By now my attention was diverted by watching the grounds staff attempting to resurrect the 7 feet high illuminated festive polar bear… Read more »

John Dee
4 years ago
Reply to  karenovirus

Are ‘festive polar bears’ a thing now? I really must get out more.

DevonBlueBoy
DevonBlueBoy
4 years ago
Reply to  John Dee

Only in the NHS where there’s plenty of money to throw away

Jon Garvey
4 years ago

Jacques Ellul wisely recognised that “public opinion” is actually the product of a shift to a propaganda-based society. Public opinion is actually no-one’s opinion, but is the functional outcome of propaganda. The propagandizers themselves do not believe in the public opinion; rather they are concerned only to produce the desired effect on behaviour, and tend (like Blair’s spin-doctors) to become increasingly contemptuous even of
their own ideological basis.

Paradoxically, having engineered this mythical opinion (nowadays even using the polls themselves) governments are then themselves directed by it – “We have to do this because the public demands it,” – even when they are not entirely cynical, such as guileless MPs voting in Parliament.

And so both the people and their rulers become entangled in a self-perpetuating web of lies, and the devil is the only beneficiary.

Andy R
Andy R
4 years ago
Reply to  Jon Garvey

Now consider how easy it must be to make sure your MP sees predominantly one point of view online! Think just how easy it would be to manipulate the search results of MPs, Media types, pollsters etc.

Cecil B
Cecil B
4 years ago

I suspect murder and a news blackout in dutch land

Remember the night the police opened fire?

Early reports said people had died and large numbers of shell casings lying in the streets

I counted 22 gunshots in a video clip lasting less than two minutes

Over the following days the press releases changed from ‘two people in hospital with gunshot wounds’ to ‘at least three’

Since then no names of the victims, no first hand accounts, and no recriminations from relatives

What is the dutch equivalent of a ‘D’ notice?

karenovirus
4 years ago
Reply to  Cecil B

The Daily Mail report that was linked to here at DS had 2 injured by gunshots in the sub headlines but 3 in the main text, simultaneously.

Cecil B
Cecil B
4 years ago
Reply to  karenovirus

I suspect it will be we didn’t tell you about the deaths in order to prevent further disorder during which we would have shot more of you

The dutch authorities have never denied that people died that night

Hester
Hester
4 years ago

YOUGOV started up and owned , sorry ahem I mean once owned by Nadhim Zawawi the man resposnible for mass medical experimentation and serial passport denier, I mean of course its not going to produce results that follow the Governments line, I mean that would be unethical

JayBee
4 years ago

Sadly, the Swiss result of turkeys voting for Christmas strongly suggests: No.

John001
John001
4 years ago
Reply to  JayBee

I read that there’ve been complaints about the conduct of the Swiss referendum and it may end up in court.

Deborah T
Deborah T
4 years ago

So, so true. About a year ago I tried taking part in a YouGov poll. Leading questions, not being able to find a response that fitted with my views…it annoyed me so much I didn’t go any further. ANY intelligent person who is not totally in line with the narrative would have done similar. Consequently the polls are ridiculously biased – not at all representative of public opinion. But they affect us, don’t they? They do me before socialising with a group of friends that I haven’t seen for a long time. I feel nervous – would some of them like me rounded up and forcibly injected? Then we meet, we talk, and I find that they’re just as against the crazy evil stuff as we are. Example – one couple run a care home. They did have the jabs because they felt they had to, but can see that we’re moving towards totalitarianism, are disgusted at the suggestions that primary school children should be ‘jabbed’, and all there yesterday felt absolutely that the ‘jab’ should be a choice, and that, no, fining people 3500 euros, as in Austria, is in no way giving people that can’t afford the fine… Read more »

karenovirus
4 years ago
Reply to  Deborah T

A frequent source of encouragement from lockdown proper through lockdown lite, into Tiers and gradual return of ‘privileges’ this spring was the number of initially circumspect conversations that would result in mutual agreement on doubts about The Covid, distrust of government pronouncements and dislike of unnecessary Lockdown regulations.

Sadly this often turned into disappointment as they donned their mask to enter Tesco before doing their ablutions at the sanitizer shrine.

I have been unable to have similar encounters since the extension of vaccines beyond the elderly/vulnerable but I expect the same disappointed would occur.

nottingham69
nottingham69
4 years ago

I run a business in tax advice for small business in the practical and productive sector. I can honestly say my polls, having face to face meeting with hundreds of people is the opposite and more to YOUGOV. People come in face coverings and they are invited to take them off, nobody has declined yet. I take the precaution of opening the windows before meetings and generally in the office.

That is really the message the government and it’s dreadful advisors should be putting out. If this really was about reducing virus spread.

karenovirus
4 years ago

Some while back I was idling some time with a newspaper (DM?) quiz or survey on European history/geography. The questions were not particularly taxing until #7 which went something like.

“Which European country denied
Right of Passage to the Soviet Red Army in its pursuance of the defence of freedom for all peace loving peoples of the world against Nazi aggression”

Lithuania was the obvious ‘correct’ answer from the list provided but to agree was also to accept the glaring misrepresentation of the circumstances of the time which was that Lithuania was to be occupied and annexed as part of the Nazi/Soviet non aggression pact.

I discontinued the quiz/survey.

Backlash
Backlash
4 years ago

Yes!

Mark
4 years ago

Excellent stuff! Daily Sceptic yet again justifying its existence by asking the questions that need to be covered, and doing so intelligently.

Unusual to allow comments on the article page, though isn’t it? Is that an oversight, a new policy, or just a one off for this piece?

Moderate Radical
4 years ago
Reply to  Mark

My comment ‘disappeared’. I had to repost it.

Mike Hearn
Editor
4 years ago
Reply to  Mark

Occasionally pieces are elevated to the status of a “page” and go into the sidebar for easier access. This is one of them. Sometimes they have comments enabled, sometimes not, I think there’s no policy and just depends on the whims of whoever is operating WordPress at the time.

karenovirus
4 years ago
Reply to  Mike Hearn

Such elevations to the sidebar are not at all obvious from an Android device. The only material other than Roundup or daily article publications simply disappear.

ImpObs
4 years ago

People who answer Yougov polls are likely the same type of people who think a virus that has the same odds of death as being killed in a car crash is a plague.

If the odds of death by the virus is such a high risk that we should be locked in our homes, by the same risk factor we should be prevented from driving cars.

iane
iane
4 years ago
Reply to  ImpObs

SHhhhhhh! Don’t give them ideas; anyway this is coming soon on the eco-lunacy train!

Crimson Avenger
4 years ago
Reply to  iane

Even trains have risks as they found out in Salisbury.

CrouplessCoup
CrouplessCoup
4 years ago

What’s a 74 year-old doing driving mainline (or any) trains at all? Presumably drivers are passed for fitness periodically, but are the tests up to snuff? If you read Cummins/Gerber “Eat Rich Live Long” you will find interesting critiques of tests for prediction of potential cardiac and stroke “indisposition” and suggestion of alternative measures such as CAC scan.
The other thing I’ve wondered about (and I have not bothered scouring the reports which indicate “wheel slide” rather than any human failure to react) is whether he was lately jabbed – and whether tests have indicated subsequently whether he may in fact have suffered e.g. an ischemic incident.

Crimson Avenger
4 years ago
Reply to  CrouplessCoup

The investigation showed (a) That the driver had reacted correctly, was not disabled and carried out emergency procedures, (b) a safety device operated correctly – both applied the brake in good time (c) the train lost adhesion owing to railhead conditions rendering the brakes ineffective.

Judy Watson
Judy Watson
4 years ago
Reply to  ImpObs

Just looked at worldometer for Thailands deaths from the rona.

20,000+ since this whole debacle began.

It is still below the the road deaths which average about 25,000 a year – and that is only counting the deaths at the scene of the accident not those who die later in hospital.

Hopeless
4 years ago

The ones I have seen, in many areas of life (national and local government, planning; the lot) are almost entirely loaded questions, spiced up by the omission of questions which would either upset or destroy the pollster’s predefined premises and answers. It’s just a “when did you stop beating your wife?” lark, and is both stupid and dishonest.

The lamentable fact is that many people who respond to these things, including the empanelled go-tos, are mainly as stupid and gullible, but marginally less dishonest, than the pollsters.

I worked for a few years at the international research company AGB (sold to one R. Maxwell and destroyed by him, along with the embezzled pensions of many of my colleagues), and in associated industries and while polling and audience research wasn’t whiter than white in the 1980’s, it was in general nowhere near as crooked as today’s.

DanClarke
DanClarke
4 years ago

without a doubt

Moderate Radical
4 years ago

‘Governments and media have now spent nearly two years telling the public, every single day, that Covid is an existential threat beatable only via strict and universal adherence to difficult rules. They’ve also told people explicitly that they have a civic duty to repeatedly volunteer for experimental medical substances. Thus questions about this topic are more or less perfectly calibrated to hit the weak spot of modern polling methodology.

Politicians would thus be well advised to treat these polls with enormous degrees of caution. Imposing draconian and violent policies on their own citizens because they incorrectly believe that fanatically devoted volunteers are representative of a Rousseau-ian ‘general will’ could very easily backfire.’

Given these tyrants’ unlawful and monstrous actions and decrees over the last two years, would it not be poetic justice and sublime if their attempt to coerce/force their citizens to be injected with a novel and experimental substance does indeed backfire due to overconfidence in ultimately erroneous polling, and an innumerable mass of people rise up and physically (yes physically) remove these criminals from office?

Crimson Avenger
4 years ago

I still don’t get it. The government could simply issue advice, and hysterical people could find it and follow it. They could just leave the rest of us alone.

iane
iane
4 years ago

Yes – but where’s the fun and self-importance in letting plebs decide anything?

Crimson Avenger
4 years ago
Reply to  iane

Yes but couldn’t they just get something off the top shelf and do it in private?

John Dee
4 years ago

I think you’ll find they don’t mind you killing your own granny, but draw the line at theirs. (And besides which, you just look dangerous from their hidey-hole behind the sofa.)

BJs Brain is Missing
4 years ago

Everything is happening too fast, too coordinated, too irrational and seemingly out of nowhere this variant has appeared…

Enough people have woken up to what has been going on and it has forced the controllers hand.

Stay strong folks and do not yield.

nickbowes
nickbowes
4 years ago

I have been a member of yougov for about 10 years, rarely get any political/covid related surveys-lots about banks though. They only send these covid restrictions surveys out to people who are confirmed mask zealots and people who want to be locked down for years. It is a lie that these surveys represent a wide scope of the public they simply don`t.

DevonBlueBoy
DevonBlueBoy
4 years ago
Reply to  nickbowes

In the early days of YouGov they ran surveys where the answers were visible to all responders. The majority answers were always to the left of centre. Most members are likely to be students, the ‘just resting’ crowd on benefits and the sad and lonely retired. A truism from sales: “The answers you seek are in the questions you ask”.

Garfy1967
Garfy1967
4 years ago

YouGov constantly asks leading questions which would never be allowed in a court of law. What angers me is that the first question of any poll they run determines what camp you are in and they then tailor the poll accordingly. They have no shame in then stating, “The rest of the questions in this poll are only for those who don’t agree with [insert issue here]”. So presumably, they ask the same or similar set of questions to those that DO agree with said issue and then pick what results they want to publish. It’s criminal.

John Dee
4 years ago
Reply to  Garfy1967

YouGov constantly asks leading questions which would never be allowed in a court of law.

Can’t we still leap to our feet and shout ‘Objection’?

AngloWelshDragon
4 years ago

Sign up to the YouGov app and get into the habit of completing the daily poll of 3 current affairs questions every morning. They upload new ones about 1100 each day. It’s a little thing but it helps. Today all three questions are on masks.