India Confounds the Modellers
What happened to India’s summer and autumn waves? After suffering a large surge with the emergent Indian variant (i.e., Delta) in the spring, India has defied modellers’ predictions by remaining very quiet since.
In August, Rajib Dasgupta, Chair of the Centre of Social Medicine and Community Health at Jawaharlal Nehru University, wrote for the Conversation about the “likely” imminent new autumn surge.
With about 40,000 cases and 400 deaths each day as of mid August, a new uptick is likely in the cards. The Indian states experiencing most of these new cases are those with relatively lower sero-prevalence, ranging between 50% and 70%. The 400 million sero-negative pool – that is people who have not been infected or had the vaccine – continues to be a large vulnerable group.
Forecasting by modellers indicates a third wave beginning in August and peaking at 100,000 to 150,000 infections a day by October. An alternative projection expects the peak in cases going until November.
It’s October now and the reality, of course, is a low level of infections since June and no new surge throughout summer and autumn so far. Below is the graph showing the predictions from the modelling of Mathukumalli Vidyasagar and Manindra Agrawal of the Indian Institute of Technology that Rajib Dasgupta cites above. I have added in the line of actual ‘cases’, which shows that they have trended well below the ‘optimistic’ scenario since the moment the prediction was made.

The declining trend throughout the summer and autumn has been reflected in all of India’s states bar two: Kerala and Mizoram. (In the graph below, each line represents a state; Mizoram is the top one.) Kerala, which had the lowest seroprevalence following the Delta surge (44.4% in July, despite high vaccination rates, indicating lower infection levels), has had an extended period of higher reported infection rates over the summer, though is coming down now. Mizoram, a small state in north-eastern India bordering Burma, still has an anomalously high reported infection rate, the reasons for which are unclear.

The lack of a new surge either in summer or autumn when most of the rest of the world, including neighbouring Bangladesh, experienced one associated with the Delta variant is further evidence of the key role that variants play in driving surges. It is also evidence of the role of herd immunity in ending outbreaks, where herd immunity is to some degree variant-specific and partly disrupted by the arrival of a new variant.
While antibody levels were running high in India in July following the Delta outbreak, it’s not clear what the contribution to these was from infection and what from vaccination. It’s also unclear how sensitive the antibody tests were, making comparisons with other countries unreliable. One thing we do know is that when new daily reported infections peaked on May 8th, less than 2.5% of the population was reported to be double-vaccinated, and the number increased only slowly during the summer. This suggests that vaccination played little role in ending the outbreak. Vaccination has also not prevented new surges from appearing elsewhere in the world.

The lack of a successful new variant yet emerging anywhere to take over from Delta is one of the key features of the pandemic at the present moment. It makes predicting the course of events in the coming winter difficult. There will of course be a seasonal wave of a respiratory virus, as there is every year, and as in most years it will presumably spike in December and decline in January (the reasons for this consistent pattern are not fully understood – January is a colder month than December, after all – though it likely has something to do with herd immunity).
Some experts I have spoken to think it will be a mild winter, at least Covid-wise, as the combination of herd immunity, vaccines and the absence of a new variant limit the scope of the virus to do very much, even in the depths of winter. Others foresee a tough winter ahead as seasonal factors lower immunity and raise the herd immunity threshold, allowing Delta (or another variant) to surge again. (A number of these experts aren’t very convinced about how well the vaccines work, including against serious disease and death.)
Me? I’m more in the mild camp, owing to herd immunity (provided a new variant doesn’t show up to disrupt it), mainly from infection, though vaccines should give some protection against serious disease and death (how long for, and how they will cope with the winter, are uncertainties, however). I even wonder whether we might be surprised and see a different virus jump in there now that SARS-CoV-2 is coming up against more resistance and running out of tricks. But hedging my bets, I’ve said I think Covid positivity won’t go above 8%, which is 60% of last year’s winter peak (13.3% on January 4th). A less sanguine scientist friend has put his bet on anything above 8%, so it’s on. What are your predictions for the coming winter? Add them in the comments below.
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Could it be because modelling is shit?
I saw Peter McCullough talking about how many Indian states had rolled out early treatment with Ivermectin, which is cheap and widely available there? Any reports to support that?
Some info here WW –
https://www.sott.net/article/459021-Indias-Ivermectin-blackout-The-secret-revealed
Thanks for that HGG. I missed any previous coverage of the home testing and medical kits the country rolled out.
The WHO even applauded the early treatment in Uttar Pradesh, but carefully excised any mention of ivermectin from news releases.
They did in Uttar Pradesh and the impact was massive. Hundreds of millions of packs sent out.
Oh but the BBC are on the case.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/health-58170809
“Health authorities in Peru and India have stopped recommending ivermectin in treatment guidelines.”
All they need is two health authorities in India to not recommend it and the above statement is true. See how they do this?
Interesting read. The only thing in there this which is not waffle seems to be about an inadvertent copy’n’paste error when preparing a paper for publication. The garbled paper has since been retracted by its authors. No more details are known about this.
Ends with a classic urban legend: Anonymous GP from South Africa had an anonymous relative who reportedly didn’t get vaccinated, got infected with COVID, took Ivermectin and then died for an unreported reason. All the right nudges, no real content, impossible to verify, one-off anecdote.
Really good article here:
https://www.thedesertreview.com/opinion/columnists/indias-ivermectin-blackout—part-v-the-secret-revealed/article_9a37d9a8-1fb2-11ec-a94b-47343582647b.html
That’ll be it.
Probably using Ferguson’s magic code.
They prefer if you call it “stochastic”.
Lol.
I seem to remember Ferguson’s had plenty of “randomness”.
Again, that’s not the word they want you to use, but it’s accurate.
When run multi-threaded, and given the same inputs and pseudo-random seed, it produced different outputs every time.
That’s not “stochastic”, it is indeed just uselessly random. Or given the complete lack of any sort of unit or regression tests in the original code, I would describe it as a way of turning data into garbage.
But at the macro/conceptual level (i.e. outside the precise issues of coding), what strikes me is an implied total failure to do the obvious when outputs are so critically wrong – run the model against the reality, adjust, rinse and repeat.
There has to be a feed-back loop in any useful modelling exercise.
Unfortunately that would require a degree of intelligence and diligence by those doing the task. It would also need to have no desire for a preferred outcome.
I think we might be able to see the problem(s) with that in this case.
It certainly worked well at that.
Ferguson thought Monte Carlo was the same thing as random. The man is an utter charlatan.
Thank you for this. I have a colleague who refuses to come back to the office and has been citing “the terrible situation in India” recently. I couldn’t find anything on it; this supports my suspicion that there is no terrible situation in India and my colleague is just bone idle.
Your colleague is one of the Nudge units lab rats. S/he’s behaving as predicted and as they want.
Ask them how many Covid cases and deaths there are in India. Same question for the UK. Then ask What is the population of India and the population of the UK. Can they express those cases/deaths as a percentage of the population?
Short answer. India is 20 times larger than the UK.
Hope your colleague is benefiting your office by their absence.
We do a lot of data work, and I am surprised that she doesn’t seem to know the importance of a denominator (you won’t be surprised to learn we do not work in the private sector!). And yes, we are getting on much better without her!
“We do a lot of data work, and I am surprised that she doesn’t seem to know the importance of a denominator”
Well, I expect she probably knows very well the importance of a denominator. I know many clever people that do a lot of data work and most of them are covidians and would not be able to quote you any figures that were accurate on covid. They simply lack curiosity or the ability to apply their specialised knowledge and abilities outside of their job. When you point out their misconceptions, they simply shut down because they don’t want to face the awful truth that they’ve been had and that our leaders are evil or mad.
BTW I work in the private sector and it’s no better.
Wonder if your colleague has seen this. notice any similarities?!
There was another fake news piece I saw months ago – an Indian man carrying a large gas bottle allegedly ‘in desperate search of Co2 for the local hospital‘.
Turns out he was just a roadside mechanic, another video from a different angle recorded him just out refilling his gas bottle with acetylene for his welding torch.
You don’t need to lie about these things if there is a genuine public health crisis.
It was just another scare story to keep everyone wearing their face masks and cower behind the sofa. Let’s face it, there isn’t even a ‘Delta variant’ – it’s all made-up bollocks.
That is a stupid argument, like “finish your dinner, there are children in Africa who are starving”.
#IVERMECTIN
I thought it was now fairly well established that this was down to ivermectin?
The Indian Council of Medical Research started recommending ivermectin (and hydroxychloroquine) on May 17th. Their cases and deaths plateaued and then plummeted immediately thereafter. I’m aware of the post hoc, ergo propter hoc fallacy, but it wasn’t vaccination or lockdowns that caused that.
They removed those recommendations on September 23rd. I pray to all their various gods that their physicians ignore that and keep prescribing.
Well worth reading:
https://www.thedesertreview.com/opinion/columnists/indias-ivermectin-blackout—part-v-the-secret-revealed/article_9a37d9a8-1fb2-11ec-a94b-47343582647b.html
They stopped testing when they ran out of Matt Hancock’s excess testing stock he shipped there during the ‘surge’..?
Interesting case study because Modi is clearly on board with the programme – the Ivermectin revolution appears to have happened at state level (Uttar Pradesh in particular) rather like in the USA. Either way, Guardian readers will bat this away and focus their attention on some other hotspot or variant to maintain their fantasy. Good to see the globalists hit another bump in the road.
Guardian readers will say “well you can’t trust those numbers, they definitely have more it just isn’t being reported’ cuz ya know, you can only trust the data if it’s supporting your own delusional hypothesis cuz that’s science
Also betraying a somewhat ironic white saviour complex – “Poor backward India – if only we could get our western genetic miracle into their arms faster, nothing to protect them but horse dewormer”
The white saviour thing is so weirdly cognitively dissonant. We are bending over backwards to de-colonise, yet we want to send precisely the countries we colonised in the first place our white man’s medicine because their’s is obviously so rubbish, ineffectual and dangerous… This is a really good essay on this subject, from last year: https://charleseisenstein.org/essays/the-banquet-of-whiteness/
Great article. And yes the cognitive dissonance is breathtaking. I particularly love the ‘I’m not sure we should be receiving boosters when there’s still so many people in need in developing countries’ argument 🤢 vomit inducing and wrong on so many levels!
yes – so bleeding obvious it shouldn’t need the very good essay to explain it. We must decolonise! Whilst we colonise! Because – er white man medicine !
It ain’t just Guardian readers – the same applies to a large proportion of right-wing newspaper readers as well.
Agreed, this isn’t necessarily a left/right thing. But when I want to enter one of Dante’s circles of hell, I read a Guardian comment section
Once upon a time I felt grown up and clever because I read The Guardian. Now it makes me feel physically sick to even glance at it. I’m not sure which one of us has changed the most to bring this about…. 🤔
I used to read it too – don’t any more. Of course it always had an element of metropolitan smugness, but it seems to have got much worse under the current editor, who seems to have focussed on constantly pushing divisive identity politics and wokeness.
Them, I used to agree with the Guardian too when they helped Snowden’s leaks and stood up against overzealous abuses conducted in the name of counter-“terrorism”, but something happened at the start of the panidemic where they were taken over by a health obsessed lunatic fringefrom the authoritarian left rather than the liberal left which they used to be.
Or is it merely that they started accepting funding from the BMGF?
You are absolutely right, but the Guardian style take on it is somehow uniquely infuriating.
ICMR started recommending ivermectin across the nation on May 17th, and their cases and deaths plummeted shortly thereafter.
Indian press is reporting consistent decline and the highest recovery rates since March 2020. For example..
https://www.firstpost.com/india/india-logs-22431-new-covid-19-cases-318-deaths-at-97-95-recovery-rate-highest-since-march-2020-10033291.html
The ministry stressed that more than 70 percent of the deaths occurred due to comorbidities. “
RE predictions Will, I don’t think it will actually matter what the covid “rates” are – the NHS will be super busy like it always is, old people will be taking up lots of beds like they always do (not their fault), staff will be leaving, capacity will be lower because “covid” and yet waiting lists continuing to stack up because they stopped treating people. Plan B is coming and it will all be our fault for no jabbyjabs and face coverings.
For a writer presenting as well informed, it is somewhat surprising that he fails to mention the pivitol role Ivermectin played in the sudden collapse of covid in India.
Yes, the kits played a huge role.. complete media blackout in the West about them. I wonder why
I’ll raise your “media blackout” with this 100% disgusting pot of piss and lies which appeared 10 hours ago…..unbelievably tagged as “Reality Check”.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/health-58170809
Enormous resources being put in to falsely discredit something that anecdotally is saving millions of lives, therefore obviously works…..these people are as low as you can go.
“these people are as low as you can go” They are in league with Satan.
Satan would probably have stronger moral principles and a betetr sense of decency than your typical MSM coronazi.
It goes to show we’re on to something though – as a rule of thumb if it’s being fact-checked or rubbished by the BBC then its a genuine threat to ‘The Programme’.
Agree…..I only look at MSM occaisionaly to see what the “enemy” are up to. How frantic/scared they are on a particular day, if it’s a propoganda “full on” day or a day when the taps are turned off.
The articles are predictably similar in content; full on lies, half truths, out of context examples using discedited data, anecdotal nonsense….”I only wish i’d taken the jab” etc, etc, etc
BTW I know everybody on this site knows all of this; still depresses the fuck out of me reading the full extent of the deception….boy, these people are desprerate though.
@ julian…I don’t believe in God/Satan etc so the words i used that you quoted are pretty much the way i would describe the worst humans on the planet. For the avoidance of doubt I have no problem whatsoever with the architects of all this propaganda hanging once this is all over.
Can’t look. Sorry.
.
Independent scientist’s my arse. A bit like the Independent BBC.
I thought everyone in India had died from the Deadly Indian Variant? And that’s why it had all gone quiet.
Either that or that they had all moved to West Bromwich.
They’re suffering from narrative malfunction.
No, that simply isn’t true.
Some are working in a local petrol station down on the south coast – when it has petrol of course…
The reason it has petrol might even be because they are the ones working at it, perhaps an all Indian business is more immune to the disease of British bureaucracy.
Are modellers like pollsters who can give their paymaster the result they want
Pollsters give their paymasters what they want?
Who knew?
Lol!
Is that photo necessary?
Personally, when attempting to divine the future, I find that sticking the tail on the donkey is as satisfactory a method as any. It’s also cleaner than the haruspex approach, although the latter does offer the prospect of a chicken dinner afterwards.
It’s ok they can use the entrails in a local curry restaurant, waste not want not.
It won’t have died in vain.
You’re absolutely right. I checked intelligent guess-work against computer models backi autumn 2020. My brain did massively better ( in error terms) than the crap being excreted by the SAGE gang.
https://www.bitchute.com/video/DCW9J3NQtCuZ/
Re predictions, has anyone watched this GVB/Robert Malone interview? It’s been published a while so apologies if it’s been discussed before. As usual GVB making some doom-laden warnings, but I feel like he’s been pretty vindicated so far. If I understood correctly he’s saying the young are acting as a buffer to ease the selective pressure applied by the vaccines. Once you’ve jabbed the kids you’ve fucked it, essentially.
https://sagaciousnewsnetwork.net/the-unmistakable-ivermectin-miracle-in-the-indian-state-of-uttar-pradesh/
That is a really nice bookcase in the background, isn’t it. Anyway, how can we improve India’s vaccine uptake?
Empirical evidence confounds the Modellers… is the actual headline.
More or less every country has confounded the modellers actually
Doesn’t stop governments from continuing to listen to them, unfortunately.
Ferguson is very clear proof of that!
They evidently tell them what they want to hear
Only because they haven’t hit their [insert number]th wave yet. 😬😬
“It’s tough to make predictions, especially about the future.” – Yogi Berra. Perhaps someone should tell Ferguson.
Surely the reason is that the Indian public health services don’t leave symptomatic people locked up ‘until their lips turn blue’ but carry out personal visits when symptomatic people contact them, check them out and, if they don’t need immediate hospitalisation, give them a kit to treat themselves at home.
Of course, inter-country comparisons remain difficult, because the data everywhere is (in formal statistical terms) – shite. Anything containing the terms ‘Covid’, ‘cases’ or ‘infections’ is, essentially, rubbish.
What we do know is that (remember the panic over Delta in India) :
As others point out – current ‘modelling’ is a total joke escaping from a locked and darkened room filled with autistic nerds devoid of contact with reality engaged in continual mutual masturbation.
“autistic nerds” I think you’re being charitable. I know a few autistic people and they generally have more regard for truth. My reading of the problem is the modellers’ addiction to power, funding and attention.
Yes – I was aware when using the term that I was risking confusion with an actual condition.
What I was implying was a wider use of the term as describing locked-in self-referential behaviour and a consequent lack of connection with social reality.
Yes indeed. I still think you might be being charitable and that they know very well they are talking nonsense. Perhaps not Ferguson, but I am pretty convinced Whitty and Vallance are lying through their teeth.
Indeed. I was referring to the actual modellers. But, even then, anyone with average real intelligence wouldn’t be running models that incorporate no reality feed-back, and are so persistently wrong without recognizing that they are indulging in a pointless fantasy exercise.
What happened to your twitchy stalker?
I wonder if it could be down to folks in India simply not going out of their way to test (“ARGGGGhhHHHh!!!11o1neone I might have ‘rona!”) when they catch the sniffles.
Their death rates are way down too, after peaking in May, shortly before they started recommending and issuing ivermectin.
The phantom downvoter is really damaging my sense of self importance. I only come here for purposes of confirmation bias; I’m not happy unless everybody agrees with me 100% of the time. It’s stressing me out!
In the end it isn’t the percentage of tests coming back positive which matters, it is the deaths and hospitalisations. Both will be very low, owing to effecive natural herd immunity reducing some spread and vaccines reducing serious symptoms in the vulnerable even though they don’t substantially afffect spread, unless the government decides to massage the figures because they need an excuse to make people panic and implement new tyranny. If covid death and hospitalisation figures are not low this winter I would suggest data manipulation might be the most plausible cause.
Of course it has nothing to do with the lack of vaccination and use of traditional therapies…
How can this article fail to mention India’s use of Ivermectin and their following the AAPS early treatment protocols??? It has wide use across India with the regions having the largest rollouts seeing almost zero cov whilst the ones that rejected it and went vax only surged. Please update this article with that data included.
Yes, certain states in India, using ivermectin kits with huge success. Look it up.
Could the reason there is a spike in December -going down in January across the UK and many other places around the world, be due to more seasonal socialising and everyone being skint and not going out much in January?
Or is that just too bleedin’ obvious?
Wasn’t it Prof Michael Levitt of Stamford University and nobel prize winner who worked out back in March 2020 that Covid waves had a natural cycle i.e a surge then a fall off but were not much affected by lockdown measures?. India appears to confirm his theory as does the subsequent data from many other countries. Star Covid modeller in the UK is Prof Neil Ferguson of UCL. His initial modelling assumed that there would be almost no limit to a Covid death surge. I wish we could expunge the word “exponential” from the English language and also repair Prof Ferguson’s calculator.