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Ceriain
4 years ago

How does this:

Prime Minister Boris Johnson has told the BBC that people in England are “very likely” to be able to return to “pretty much life before Covid” on July 19th, the BBC reports.

…fit in with this:

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/health-57638369

Covid: School isolation rules could end in autumn

Autumn?

I don’t remember the track and trace; the self-isolating; the masks; the QR codes as being “pretty much life before Covid”. Does anyone else?

Lifting of restrictions has to be all restrictions! Anything else is still imprisonment.

AnnabelleG
AnnabelleG
4 years ago
Reply to  Ceriain

Neither do I – It seems a huge majority of our population must want to live under a communist type regime— even they were not told they could not leave their homes or see their loved ones

Annie
4 years ago
Reply to  AnnabelleG

The worst Communist regimes killed some people. They were abominable.
But even they didn’t delete everybody’s face and stop all social interaction.

Julian
4 years ago
Reply to  Ceriain

Indeed. The madness will continue, in morphing manifestations, for many years. The contracts are already signed, and the Big Lie that covid was exceptional, and that lockdowns work and can be justified, and medico fascism, are all now deeply embedded and the de facto normal response.

NonCompliant
4 years ago
Reply to  Ceriain

Caveats a plenty. I think we all know it doesn’t end 19th July.

X - In Search of Space
X - In Search of Space
4 years ago
Reply to  Ceriain

Damn right, an end to _all_ restrictions. They are all counter-productive.

Always the same: They start out offering one thing, then gradually end up handing over something not-as-adverstised. They would be brilliant as used-car salesmen.

TheFascistCoronaFraud
TheFascistCoronaFraud
4 years ago

It’s difficult to ascertain exactly what the truth of the matter is with C19, even now, with so many accounts of the same story to take in, persuasive people and arguments, experts, “the science” (lol) but there are so many things about the narrative of the new killer mega virus that don’t sit right and having been through it all 1000x over, I am still edging towards this whole thing being a complete hoax – flu season rebadged. I believe we are at war, for me that much is certain. What are war people good at? – planning. There has been some serious planning gone into this. The ivermectin story has had me interested for some time and I have been happy to give it credence, for one because I perceive it as a good way to wake people up – they suppressed safe and effective drug treatments in order to guarantee the EUA for the jabs. It’s very seductive and it exposes the criminal nature of C19 – they blocked access to safe drugs to get experimental jabs in to arms which is criminal and disgusting. But I can’t help but be suspicious of the people pusing the ivermectin… Read more »

TheFascistCoronaFraud
TheFascistCoronaFraud
4 years ago

Global population grew in 2020. Bit weird. I thought this was the worst health crisis ever. Population grew by just over 1% in 2020. Just like it did in 2019. And in 2018…… Year Population Growth Rate 2021 7,874,965,825 1.03% 2020 7,794,798,739 1.05% 2019 7,713,468,100 1.08% 2018 7,631,091,040 1.10% This is not consistent with a world stopping pandemic. The real world does not reflect the world we are being told to believe in by the media and the shill operators online like John Campbell from Oxford Uni – who is working with Tess Lawrie. Not saying anything too harsh here, but no-one and I mean no-one is off the hook in this world, until they prove conclusively otherwise. We are living in times of massive deception and I do agree you should not judge someone by who they appear with, but you should also not rule it out when you see pepole who are supposedly on the side of truth, hanging with blatant shills. There is also the not insignificant issue over the lack of isolated virus. Can anyone point to papers which 1) prove isolation of SARS COV 2 and 2) prove transmission and the resulting symptoms with proper… Read more »

TheFascistCoronaFraud
TheFascistCoronaFraud
4 years ago

Something else that interests me was how Wuhan, Lombardy (northern Italy) and New York were some of the first places to have 5G and were also some of the main hotspots for so called C19. This has got my interest again recently because I found this paper, which was retracted, but it was initially peer reviewed and published at the NIH as well: 5G Technology and induction of coronavirus in skin cells https://scienceintegritydigest.files.wordpress.com/2020/07/fioranelli.pdf In this research, we show that 5G millimeter waves could be absorbed by dermatologic cells acting like antennas, transferred to other cells and play the main role in producing Coronaviruses in biological cells. DNA is built from charged electrons and atoms and has an inductor-like structure. This structure could be divided into linear, toroid and round inductors. Inductors interact with external electromagnetic waves, move and produce some extra waves within the cells. The shapes of these waves are similar to shapes of hexagonal and pentagonal bases of their DNA source. These waves produce some holes in liquids within the nucleus. To fill these holes, some extra hexagonal and pentagonal bases are produced. These bases could join to each other and form virus-like structures such as Coronavirus. To… Read more »

TheFascistCoronaFraud
TheFascistCoronaFraud
4 years ago

Interesting discussion about the magnetism observed in the vaxxs:

Magnetism Intentially Added to ‘Vaccines’ to Spread mRNA Through Body | Stew Peter’s Show
https://www.bitchute.com/video/KFvqIuu5TeUV/

Another interesting video here. From 2010, about a meeting the presenter Bill Ryan says took place in 2005, which was relayed to him by a senior Mason, which seems to predict a lot of what we are going through now and witnessing in real time. Not exactly, but very close to some of the events that have already taken place. It really is uncanny in many ways especially about China and the flu virus and the lockdowns, considering it was made 11 years ago. Definitely in the realms of conspiracy theory, but there is a real sense of integrity about how he comes across and some of the predictions are bone chilling. Be your own judge! And yes, I know it has 444K views but that’s spread over 11 years and he has not published anything in more than 3 years. Just saying!

The Anglo-Saxon Mission, explained by Bill Ryan : a Project Avalon video
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rw4z-rSwNjY

TheFascistCoronaFraud
TheFascistCoronaFraud
4 years ago

It’s out of date but this article has great information about the fraud that HMG has committed to facilitate death certifictae forgery and more – they literally changed the law of the land to pull this crap off. Cheating lying you know whats. Lots of evidence of fraud and foul play, no evidence of a real pandemic.

COVID 19 Is A Statistical Nonsense
https://in-this-together.com/covid-19-is-a-statistical-nonsense/

This is also very good about the psychological warfare that went with the fraud. Add the two together and you have a massive deception, but NO SIGN OF A MASSIVE PANDEMIC. We’ve been conned, that much is true.

COVID 19 – The UK Scamdemic – Part 2
https://in-this-together.com/covid-19-the-uk-scamdemic-part-2/

MTF
MTF
4 years ago

You might want to read Toby Young’s “about” section of this web site.

If you want to post comments beneath posts, try and avoid conspiracy theories. If you believe 5G masts are linked to the spread of coronavirus, or that Bill Gates is in favour of mass vaccination because he wants to implant microchips into people’s brains, this site isn’t for you. It’s important that we all keep clear heads. And if possible, try not to engage in too much partisan point-scoring”

J4mes
4 years ago
Reply to  MTF

As you showed yesterday, you’re either too scared of labels (which have been weaponised deliberately to stop people from embracing them against the government), or you’re deliberately trying to disassemble opposition to this coronamadness.

Yesterday, you said ‘I don’t agree with most of the opinions of people who subscribe to this forum’.

So why are you constantly trying to moderate this forum? Why not move on and find a forum that suits your MSM-oriented opinions?

MTF
MTF
4 years ago
Reply to  J4mes

I guess it is a matter of what you think a forum like this is for. Is a place for like-minded people to gather and reinforce their opinions or is it a place to debate with people of different opinions. I don’t find it very interesting or fruitful to simply hear the opinions of people that agree with me. Do you?

J4mes
4 years ago
Reply to  MTF

No, but I don’t spend my time on Guardian or BBC forums trying to moderate conversation when I already know ‘I don’t agree with most of the opinions of people who subscribe to this forum’. Why would I waste my time doing this unless I was driven by an agenda?

Debate is healthy, attempting to shut down discussion as regular as you do is not healthy.

MTF
MTF
4 years ago
Reply to  J4mes

I can see why this most recent comment might be interpreted as moderating the discussion and I regret it. I didn’t intend to shut down the discussion – just to point out that Toby Young would probably disagree with TheFascistCoronaFraud.

However, our previous discussion was simply about whether it is consistent to hold that lockdowns are bad but vaccines are good. How is that moderating or shutting down the discussion? In fact it lead to an extensive discussion.

TheFascistCoronaFraud
TheFascistCoronaFraud
4 years ago
Reply to  MTF

You might want to click the Free Speech Union banner on the right hand side of the page. It’s difficult to call what Toby’s true role is. They always need a net to catch and control the inevitable opposition. Lenin famously said “The best way to control the opposition is to lead it ourselves.” The British state is a master of control and deception – it’s how they do their business, it’s how they divide and rule/d the world, it’s one reason that the people of the UK have “truth issues”, to put it mildly. Toby getting gigs on Newsnight and LS being very heavy on MSM content and him being well connected is significant, but when he speaks he seems passionate and animated about getting our freedom back and that is to be applauded. He’s also running this site and while it is not perfect, in many respects it is very good – credit where it’s due. Who knows? LS does have a whiff of controlled oppostion about it ATL, I don’t think a genuine opposition would focus on the MSM narrative so heavily, not to say that we don’t need to keep a kee eye on what lines… Read more »

TheFascistCoronaFraud
TheFascistCoronaFraud
4 years ago

mmW is absorbed by the skin. The skin acts as an antenna for the millimeter waves – millimetre waves which they have legislated for and enabled without producing a shred of evidence that it is not harmful to health, with the reality being that there is tonnes of evidence that this stuff is VERY harmful to health.

5G Technology: Potential Risks To Human Health: Excerpts From Scientific Conference
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QvPg1AyQ43I

Hundreds of links proving wireless tech is VERY harmful to health and should in no way be omnipresent in the community and it certainly shouldn’t form the basis for the future of the NHS ffs!

Published Scientific Research on 5G, Small Cells Wireless and Health

https://committees.parliament.uk/writtenevidence/2230/html/

TheFascistCoronaFraud
TheFascistCoronaFraud
4 years ago

WiGIG @ 60 ghz aka the absorption frequency for oxygen molecules is NOT conspiracy theory

WiGig, alternatively known as 60 GHz Wi-Fi….
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/WiGig

MTF
MTF
4 years ago

When YOU MTF, who is in the high % or certainty range of being a paid agent to derail threads – when you come to derail this conversation, I take it as a compliment and as a sign that maybe these are truths certain actors DO NOT want people talking about, so all the more reason to discuss them as far as I am concerned. Maybe you’re just narrow minded and quintessentially British in being unable to process unpleasant discussion so you shut people down? No, you only come here to close down and derail the conversations, I’ve had this out with you before.”

If only I was being paid!

It is strange to be accused of closing down and derailing conversations. Typically I raise a point of disagreement with something that has been written and then a lengthy discussion ensues – usually a lot longer than most discussions on this site. How is that closing down or derailing a conversation? How else would you expect someone who disagreed to proceed?

Monro
4 years ago

“Why aren’t the British people saying, ‘We’ve had it!’” “The British people haven’t risen up as one and said ‘enough’.” For exactly the same reason that the NHS lies supine, like a beached whale, incapable even of curing itself; unreformed. Apparently it is known as the ‘free rider’ problem; the reason socialism is an ideal, impractical in the real world Socialism is an insidious disease that creeps up on a nation slowly and saps its willpower, just as a tick enlarges itself, all the while infecting its host with the lethargy of Lyme’s disease. There is a cure for the state health sector’s bloated bureaucracy, the hopeless buffoonery of its incompetent managerial layer: Social health insurance modelled on best practice within continental health systems demonstrably so much better than our own. https://iea.org.uk/wp-content/uploads/2016/12/Niemietz-NHS-Interactive.pdf We know health insurance works; that is how the NHS started out, and we have a number of successful not for profit health insurance companies already well established in this country. But the apathy already engendered here by democratic socialism, the sheer weight of free riders, suggests that Britain, very much like the European Union that it left, too late, is now incapable of the fundamental reform undoubtedly… Read more »

Julian
4 years ago
Reply to  Monro

I agree some of those factors have been at play. But I think much more decisive has been the propaganda – huge and unprecedented.

Monro
4 years ago
Reply to  Julian

Endemic in socialist states……….

Annie
4 years ago
Reply to  Monro

… but cowardice, laziness and stupidity are endemic in the entire human race. It’s always the thoughts and actions of a tiny minority that drive progress, often against stubborn resistance. Britain’s zombie population would be poor intellectual competition for Pithecanthropus..

Julian
4 years ago
Reply to  Monro

Can you give some examples of socialist and non-socialist states, in your view?

Monro
4 years ago
Reply to  Julian

Of course, it’s a spectrum. There is a wealth of discussion available but the IEA sums up my view: ‘Imagine two hypothetical societies: Nordland and Bolivaria. In Bolivaria, taxes are fairly low. But the state is involved in economic life at every step of the way. It owns and runs a large number of companies, it sets most prices and wages, it directs investment flows, it directs trade flows, it allocates goods and services, and so on. It is not a pure socialist economy, but the state occupies most of the economy’s commanding heights. Meanwhile in Nordland, the state generally stays out of economic activity. Companies are privately owned, prices and wages are set by the market, and the market also directs investment flows and trade flows, as well as allocating goods and services. The government of Nordland leaves the market alone to create wealth. But once the market has done that, the government takes a very large chunk of that wealth, and redistributes it. Nordland is a high-tax economy with high levels of public spending. Which of these two economies is closer to a free market? It depends on the details, but unless the tax burden in Nordland is… Read more »

Julian
4 years ago
Reply to  Monro

Well thanks but I am still a bit unclear, TBH. The coronamadness and associated propaganda has been present in most of the rich world, with very few exceptions. I suppose I was wondering if you considered most or all of those countries to be “socialist”.

Monro
4 years ago
Reply to  Julian

Yes.

And large corporations, oligopolies, are, in the main, akin to para statal socialist enterprises.

I very much agree with ‘Mark’ elsewhere on this thread, but, first, let’s fix what can be fixed at home, since large corporations require lengthy international negotiations for effective regulation, as we have seen.

RickH
4 years ago
Reply to  Monro

Trans. ”Socialist’ is a term I use for anything I don’t fancy. It has no other real meaning as a political term”

Monro
4 years ago
Reply to  RickH

spectrum

  • range, gamut, sweep, scope, span.
  • scale.
  • variety.
  • compass, orbit, ambit

obtuse

  • stupid
  • dull
  • slow-witted
  • slow
  • dull-witted
  • unintelligent
  • witless
  • half-baked
  • half-witted
  • doltish
  • lumpish
  • blockish
  • imperceptive
eastender53
4 years ago
Reply to  RickH

You’ve hit the nail right on the head. Some people create a personalised political system that suits their very particular circumstances and everything counter to that goes in a box marked ‘Socialism’.

Others call that box ‘Care for your fellow man’.

Mark
4 years ago
Reply to  Julian

I suppose I was wondering if you considered most or all of those countries to be “socialist”.”

Worth observing here that if he does take that view (which I think is broadly correct) then it would be an opinion shared with former US Supreme Court justice Scalia, as per the link you kindly posted the other day, and we discussed at the time.

RickH
4 years ago
Reply to  Monro

Yawn.

Lucan Grey
4 years ago
Reply to  Monro

Quite why anybody things insurance works for healthcare is beyond me. It does nothing other than create a load of pointless work for claims assessor that just doubles up the job the medical assessors are already undertaking. Single payer works and is demonstrably the best way of doing things. The NHS has been a private operation since day one. Every single GP is a private business and always has been. That hasn’t improved appointment times. Fundamentally healthcare provision is supply-side limited as there are not enough healthcare professionals to go around. It is not amenable to productivity improvement as there is little that can be massified and shared that isn’t already. More money and more investment will not produce much, if any, greater provision. Therefore it can only ever be rationed by time, not money. All ‘market reforms’ are about reserving more of the scarce medical resources for the use of the rich, than the poor. That is what private provision does – allows people with money to jump the queue. Queues favour the poor, since their time isn’t as valuable. Taxing by time is a very progressive tax. There is much that is troublesome about the NHS. Age causes… Read more »

Julian
4 years ago
Reply to  Lucan Grey

I think a lot of the problem is the involvement of the government. If the NHS was a completely independent body that somehow funded itself, perhaps the govt would find it harder to use the NHS as an excuse to restrict liberty arbitrarily

RickH
4 years ago
Reply to  Julian

Exactly. One general problem in this country is political centralisation and overweening influence.

Monro
4 years ago
Reply to  Lucan Grey

It may not be an easy fix, but it needs fixing.

The first thing to fix is the funding model.

We know healthcare social insurance works. It works across most of our neighbours. BUPA in this country gets very good customer ratings.

If the developed countries of continental Europe can have a decent, properly funded, system of healthcare, then, plainly, the same thing must be possible here.

Julian
4 years ago
Reply to  Monro

Are they not very similar to here? As I understand it, people buy their own insurance but for those who cannot afford it, the state buys it for them.

Monro
4 years ago
Reply to  Julian

The point is that the funding model is more effective, more total spending on healthcare which is precisely what is required in this country, but the golden goose hisses loudly at direct taxation so a different way must be found to pluck it….and that method is being used with great success elsewhere: ‘As Ronald Reagan used to say, ‘It’s not easy, but it is simple.’ ‘Niemietz rightly reminds us of the prehistory of the NHS, the rich roots in mutualism and municipalism. That history is a resource for reminding us that non-state provision is not alien to the UK’ ‘….the UK has one of the highest rates of avoidable deaths in Western Europe. If this rate were cut to the levels observed in Belgium, more than 10,000 lives would be saved every year. More than 13,000 lives would be saved if the rate were cut to Dutch levels.’ ‘The UK spends less on healthcare than many other developed countries, but this must not be mistaken for a sign of superior efficiency. It is mostly the result of crude rationing: innovative medicines and therapies that are routinely available in other high-income countries are often hard to come by in the UK.’… Read more »

chris c
chris c
4 years ago
Reply to  Monro

Australia too I believe.

The NHS, spending pounds to save pennies

TheyLiveAndWeLockdown
4 years ago
Reply to  Lucan Grey

“Single payer works and is demonstrably the best way of doing things.”
Wow and I thought your faith in MMT was demonstrably cretinous, this is a new level of health massacring crazy.

Monro
4 years ago
Reply to  Lucan Grey

GPs are a private business in the same way that businesses wholly reliant on government contracts are private businesses…….not really.

All types of contract are managed by the NHS commissioner…’

The GP funding system is quite mad (check the comments):

https://www.kingsfund.org.uk/publications/gp-funding-and-contracts-explained

Mark
4 years ago
Reply to  Monro

As a critique of state involvement in health, that’s fine as far as it goes. But it does not address the two-pronged threat we face. If we should have learned anything from the past few decades, it’s that big corporate power is every bit as threatening and corrupting as state power.

The faith of Randians and such in competition to control corporate power has been demonstrated to be naive, over and over again, much as the faith of socialists in state power has been. And the cry in response tends to be the same: “ah, but socialism/free market has never been tried properly“…

The answer to the NHS problem is to stop pretending individual health is a legitimate concern of government. But even if that could be done in the face of the huge bipartisan corrupt and personal interests in sustaining the existing leviathans, that wouldn’t solve the underlying problems we face of big state and big corporate power.

Mark
4 years ago
Reply to  Monro

Socialism is an insidious disease that creeps up on a nation slowly and saps its willpower, just as a tick enlarges itself, all the while infecting its host with the lethargy of Lyme’s disease.

Indeed so. And it infected and became dominant in pretty much every state in the world during the C20th.

But this does not account for the part played by big corps and the super rich. A lot of the debilitation in our culture has been imposed by insurance companies. The massive media and advertising corporations have been the willing conduits for all that debilitation, culminating in the coronapanic. The banks and financial corps and service providers cooperate to take down Parler and restrict access to Gab to suppress any possibility of speech outside the controlled parameters of the socialist consensus.

In the end, the problem with state power is the same as the problem with big corporate power -they are vehicles for individual power.

Brett_McS
4 years ago
Reply to  Monro

Some General Practitioners in the US work independently on a subscription model. It makes a lot of sense.

Monro
4 years ago
Reply to  Brett_McS

Yes indeed. Unfortunately sense and healthcare in Britain are mutually exclusive concepts. Even on this site there is clearly no consensus in favour of NHS reform drawing from best practice on the continent, so many developed countries there so much better served by their health sector than we are by ours.

Healthcare is highly political in Britain. Labour will always outbid the conservatives on health spending. The conservatives have wised up to that and painted labour into a corner by massive completely unaffordable spending during this manufactured health emergency. Consequently all opposition is neutered, labour pro extended lockdown and unpopular; the government totalitarian yet apparently still popular.

As I say, time to locate Galt’s Gulch.

Julian
4 years ago

Interesting to read that someone tested positive twice at two different times. Given that reinfection is rare, at least one of those tests is likely to be a false positive. Given the huge volume of testing going on, you’d think one of the stats you could find easily is the number of people testing positive more than once, or if not that then the number of unique people who’ve tested positive.

OMatt
OMatt
4 years ago
Reply to  Julian

Are there any published stats on number of tests taken per day?

I’ve assumed that the “number of new cases” quoted in the news each day are rubbish, as surely it depends entirely on how many tests were taken. Am I right, or being unfair? Do the figures somehow take into account the number of tests taken?

(I’ve never been tested during this whole thing, so I have no idea how it works. Who exactly is getting tested, and why? Do people who feel fine go and get tested, only to find they’re “infected” – and then have to stay home for 14 days?)

Julian
4 years ago
Reply to  OMatt

Official UK govt data is here: https://coronavirus.data.gov.uk/

Yes of course the raw test numbers are useless without context – not only the numbers of tests but also WHO is getting tested, which is somewhat random, how many cycles the tests are run at, what type of test

Testing is going to be in medical settings, for staff and patients, in care homes, a lot in secondary schools (and the parents get tested too) and probably quite a few employers, as well as people who feel unwell or think they do. I don’t know the law regarding self-isolation. I think if you’re contacted by Track and Trace through the app or because you’ve been in contact with someone, then I think you are legally compelled to self isolate on pain of a fine if you don’t do it. I am pretty sure I read that law – it’ll be a Statutory Instrument (govt by ministerial fiat) attached to the 1984 Public Health act, like most of the covid regs. But I don’t remember seeing any regs if you decide to test yourself.

Brett_McS
4 years ago
Reply to  Julian

You can get reinfected any number of times, but after the first one you don’t get sick.

Fingerache Philip
Fingerache Philip
4 years ago

Reading Andrew Marr’s account of his Covid infection symptoms.
: its exactly the same as my and Mrs FP’s FLU at the end of 2018, only ours lasted 3 weeks instead of Marr’s 1.

John
4 years ago

That is the real problem, there’s no way to distinguish between a SARS-CoV-2 infection and another infection. The delta variant has symptoms associated with the common cold.

JayBee
4 years ago
Reply to  John

Covid 19 is just aa list of common symptoms, rebadged as Covid 19. Another part of the fraud.

eastender53
4 years ago
Reply to  John

If there’s no way to distinguish then why even agree that it exists, or deserves its own popular name? To most people a cold is a cold, flu is flu. This is despite the fact that the virus causing these can be one of many.

Fingerache Philip
Fingerache Philip
4 years ago
Reply to  eastender53

ABSOLUTELY!

Attaboy
Attaboy
4 years ago

Toby for PM

Mark
4 years ago
Reply to  Attaboy

There’s plenty I disagree with Toby about (and in fairness plenty I agree with him about).

But I’d take him in a heartbeat over any of the candidates seriously on offer.

NonCompliant
4 years ago

Whilst I agree with Toby’s sentiment in the clip, he and those in similar positions in the public eye have left it far too late to push back. The time to organise was last summer, not now.

There’s an awful lot of ground for us to retake and people are more likely to be cajoled out of the Covid Cult by people of Toby’s ilk than the people like me posting here!

I had hoped this much was obvious last summer but I guess not. 🙁

Julian
4 years ago
Reply to  NonCompliant

Pushing back to be effective in the short term requires massive funding from people who have millions they can happily give away and who don’t care about their reputations. It requires a large team of professionals from various spheres to work full time on counteracting the propaganda. Can you imagine the vitriol or worse that such a campaign would attract?

Mark
4 years ago
Reply to  Julian

The corollary of what you say is that the hugely wealthy groups and individuals who have suffered the most from this, in the airline, travel and hospitality businesses for instance, needed to organise a massive and coordinated spend to resist the fear propaganda, early on. They should have seen the consequences that the fear push was building towards, and organised to save themselves. It’s not as though it was impossible to see what was happening and what was needed. You and I, and others, saw it quite early on, and said so here, and a few such as Dolan saw it and took action, but the big players either didn’t see it, were part of it or feared to resist it. Hard to have much sympathy for them now. But – and it’s a big but – they might have been correct to fear taking action, in the sense that they probably know that the rug could have been pulled out from under them very easily. Even if they could resist the hysterical smear mobs that would have been whipped up against them, in the end, as we saw with the attempts to create dissenting conservative speech platforms outside the… Read more »

Julian
4 years ago
Reply to  Mark

I think the best one could have hoped for was a billionaire or group of multi millionaires who were independently wealthy and owned or controlled their own businesses so were able to make decisions and be accountable to no-one. Most big businesses are owned by a very wide group of shareholders and/or in hoc to banks and it’s hard to see any of them taking the kind of action that was needed. That said, some limited, targeted action to defend their own businesses, based on the inconsistent, arbitrary and unscientific nature of the laws as it affected their business, would have helped had it occurred in multiple sectors and had wide backing. There were some legal actions along those lines, but very few and not universally supported.

What I was initially referring to was a movement to discredit the coronapanic. That would be much more dangerous for anyone taking a leading role, and may well have seen a brutal reaction from those in power, as they would have felt threatened.

NonCompliant
4 years ago
Reply to  Julian

Do you want vitriol or eternal slavery? That’s what’s coming down the pipe. You don’t need millions either, i’m sorry but that’s just not true.

A decent sized, organised group with people of Toby’s stature would’ve brought a lot of people along with them, they still could. I see absolutely no attempt to pool resources, just a lot of chuntering at the individual level.

Everyone knows by now who’s in Team Humanity. The buggers need to start teaming up and delivering a consistent and hard hitting message to their audiences.

Milos
4 years ago

Jeffrey A.T. found a video clip of a conference on epidemics 10y ago in which also DA Henderson attended.
The main takeaway from DA Henderson’s remarks here, the primary trait that is striking, is his humility. Here he is the world’s leading epidemiologist and his central message is: there isn’t that much we can do so let’s at least don’t do harm.
https://twitter.com/jeffreyatucker/status/1409678050346758164

It’s important video, but had only ~500 views up until now. I jumped trough it. Also other people had important remarks on general futility of trying to suppress epidemic with various methods.
Think it’s worth a mention.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8rEV857R0LE

Mark
4 years ago

“America Would Look Like Canada if Florida Hadn’t Fought Against Lockdowns” – Breitbart spotlights Governor Ron DeSantis’s appearance on Fox over the weekend, where he touted Florida’s success in its handling of the coronavirus pandemic If there is hope for us in the US sphere it lies in the US and with the Republicans – the only mainstream political force offering any real resistance to the coronapanic agenda. Not enough resistance and by no means united in that resistance, but at least some, at the very highest levels (Governors and Senators). It’s easy to point to weaknesses and compromises in the Republican resistance, but contrast it with the UK and the rest of the anglophone world (not just Canada, which de Santis highlights because they are the US’s direct neighbour and comparator), where there has been basically zero top level genuine resistance. This is not chance. The coronapanic has been – among other things – fundamentally a clear case of putting big government ahead of individual rights. Fear has been the tool and the driver, but the effect has been to promote state power and thereby enable all the agendas that depend on state power over individual and communal resistance. The problem… Read more »

Noumenon
4 years ago
Reply to  Mark

Conservatism requires something to conserve. The problem is that there are now so many disenfranchised people who are dependent on either tax money, debt or corporate wage slavery that the power rests almost completely with the class of lenders, taxers and corporate monopolist employers.

eastender53
4 years ago

It’s so bloody predictable. So bloody depressing. Now that the narrative is beginning to turn against further Lockdowns (at least until September), the excuses will start. Guess what, new research masks are pretty much useless. Apart from, that is, this amazing new one that the NHS will have. Now Hancocks mates are hopefully out of the running, who will get the £m for these I wonder?

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/health-57636360

Moist Von Lipwig
4 years ago

As always, great fat communist fraud Kim Jong Johnson spouts rubbish with innumerable get-out clauses crammed into few words.

Got to keep the torture going, eh, you spineless worm?

X - In Search of Space
X - In Search of Space
4 years ago

The gov have made things awkward for themselves by saying that ending of restrictions would be irreversible (I obviously believe that should be the case btw).

Their stating that means that it is harder for them to actually let go, because they have created the dilemma of ‘what if we do end all restrictions and then find it was a mistake/premature?’

They would have made it easier for themselves by not mentioning anything about it being irreversible.

I don’t think any here will be in the least surprised to find that whatever the outcome on July 19th – the reality is not an end to many, let alone all impositions. We are likely in for a bunch of re-tweaking and re-education I think.

——-

Come on ladies and gents, only 1 careful owner …..

Julian
4 years ago

They have probably made it a little harder for themselves, but they’ve gone back on what was promised many times and not really paid much of a price politically – all they will need to do is point to “cases” or some new variant or whatever and shrug and say it’s not their fault, what can they do?

RickH
4 years ago

Great phrase ;

“… the bottomless well of public policy insanity to institute self-harming non-solutions to a non-crisis””

Barbara Baker
Barbara Baker
4 years ago
Reply to  RickH

Indeed – stole that one for my quote of the day email to my excitably pro vax, pro lockdown MP

JayBee
4 years ago

I fully agree with the Spectator OZ article and especially this assessment:
“In her Australian column on 19 June, Gemma Tognini listed several seemingly fringe-dwelling anxieties among people about the vaccines.
I believe the biggest contributor to that is people’s dwindling faith in the honesty, integrity and transparency of health bureaucrats and governments.”
And that damage is now permanent, govs, certainly in my case.

Fingerache Philip
Fingerache Philip
4 years ago

JHB asked a Conservative MP this morning on TR if he thought that the Brexiteer mp’s are the ones who are the most likely to be against lockdown, if so, how did
the Bozzer who led the Brexit cause become a cheerleader for lockdown?

Fingerache Philip
Fingerache Philip
4 years ago

The Bozzer and Saj says we must learn to live with Covid.
JESUS H CHRIST!!!!!
What have we been saying these last 15 months????

HelzBelz
4 years ago

I think they mean living with it somewhat differently to how we would mean it.

Fingerache Philip
Fingerache Philip
4 years ago
Reply to  HelzBelz

VERY TRUE.

huxleypiggles
4 years ago

Bloody hell – essay writer after essay writer.